Infidelity is a deal breaker for a lot of people, especially after marriage vows have been exchanged. It's also an individual boundary that people must determine for themselves.
But friends and family don't always respect that and try to influence the decision, either telling the person to stay or demanding they leave.
A wife dealing with an unfaithful husband and his mother's opinions turned to the "Am I The A**Hole" (AITAH) subReddit for feedback.
Similar to AITA, the AITAH subReddit allows posters to ask for advice and post about ending romantic relationships—both things that are banned on AITA. However, there are no required voting acronyms—only suggested ones—and no official final judgment declared.
Ok-Spot-3558 asked:
"AITAH for asking my mother-in-law for advice on how she dealt with her husband's affair after she said I needed to work on my marriage when her son cheated on me?"
The original poster (OP) explained:
"I am currently married to Matthew. He had an affair. I filed for divorce."
"His mother came to me and said I needed to work on my marriage and not give up so easily. So I asked her how she dealt with her husband's infidelity in their marriage."
"She started stammering and asking what I was talking about. So I said that five years ago her husband had an affair. If she expects me to work through this, I need advice."
"How did she deal with her husband having an affair. I told her that Matthew had asked me not to talk about it so I had kept my mouth shut. She got up and left."
"From what I have heard, they had a massive fight. Her husband is denying everything. Matthew denied that he knew anything about the affair, much less telling me to act as if nothing happened."
"My MIL is pissed at her husband for cheating and at Matthew for keeping her in the dark. For the record, I just wanted her to leave me alone and think about my point of view when I made up the affair."
The OP later added:
"Here's some information, I guess, that was relevant that I didn't consider."
"I only found out about my husband's affair because Matthew gave me Chlamydia. I found out about his other affairs while fighting with him."
"My father-in-law said he was golfing with Matthew on Saturdays. And that they were taking overnight fishing trips."
"He did this to help Matthew have excuses for his absence from home. He helped Matthew cheat."
"Lastly, my mother-in-law came to my home—which she owns and gave us cheap rent on—while I was packing up my stuff to move out. That's why I let her in."
Some Redditors weighed in by using the AITA voting acronyms:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
- INFO - more information needed
Redditors were split in their judgment, with some thinking the OP's lie was justified (NTA).
"OK, at first I thought NTA, then read that you made it up and thought YTA, then I read that the FIL helped cover up your husband's affair."
"NTA. That family is toxic." ~ TheSystem08
"Toxic family. OP, you put her in her place for trying to tell you how to handle your business. Her focus should be on her son, giving him guidance and hoping you don't leave him."
"Honestly, if I cheated on my wife and my mother told my wife something like this, I'd be pissed. It would not be my wife's responsibility to work on our marriage if I were the one to break her trust." ~ Just_Fish2623
"NTA. If father-in-law was willing to cover up the cheating, I don't trust that he isn't a cheater himself. And to be honest, it would take more than someone telling me my spouse was cheating to believe it, so I'm guessing your mother-in-law already had some doubts on her end. Good luck in your divorce." ~ UrHumbleNarr8or
"Let's be real.. If homie is covering for his son like that, he def was the OG cheater who showed his son the way. Ain't no way in hell MIL doesn't need an STI screening." ~ TrixIx
"If he helped his son cover up the affair, FIL either has such a low opinion of you he 'pities' his son for being married to you OR he's one of those men that think men should get their physical needs met 100% of the time, no matter the circumstances, in which case it's incredibly likely he has indeed had an affair."
"I'm not usually one for throwing a grenade in someone else's marriage, but between FIL's actions and Matthew's mom not leaving you alone when she obviously (from her reaction) has an issue with cheating, I'm not 100% that you're an AH here despite your lie." ~ ShermanOneNine87
But others felt everyone—or almost everyone—sucked (ESH) or that just the OP did (YTA).
"So your FIL wasn't cheating then? You made up an affair & opened up a can of whoop a** between your in-laws? ESH except maybe your MIL—you for making up that lie, your hubby for cheating, & your FIL for helping him."
"I don't know your relationship with your MIL. Is it possible she doesn't want you to leave the family? Otherwise she wouldn't care if you divorced him." ~ NoExamination1045
"ESH. They're a toxic mess, but you lied to her. You deliberately hurt someone who hadn't done a damn thing to you to get back at your ex."
"You are a nasty person that, frankly, is no better than your FIL in my opinion. Possibly worse." ~ abritinthebay
"These comments are always wild. YTA. You straight up lied and might have ended a marriage that had nothing to do with anything that happened to you."
"All because a father covered for a mistake his son did.
"And HOLY SH*T THE COMMENTS SAYING THEY UNDERSTAND‽‽"
"Nah, ya'll are cooked, and none of you are good people if you support what OP did. Making up false accusations is just as bad as you doing them yourself."
"Get f*cked OP. Maybe there was a reason your marriage ended up in this position after all, if this is the person you are." ~ Vox_SFX
"Sure, OP's husband is a cheating sack of crap. MIL was meddlesome, no doubt."
"Lying, though, and possibly blowing up her in-laws' relationship? Come on… that makes OP just as bad as the rest of them, if not worse." ~ LilMissRoRo
"ESH. You effectively got her to understand the horseshit she was trying to make you swallow. Her reaction is peak 'rules for thee, not for me' hypocrisy."
"I'm a petty Betty around infidelity. I like your style and applaud the quick thinking."
"However... A lie is still a lie. You would be no better than the cheater by allowing the lie to stand."
"Come clean with her. Make sure you point out that her feelings are no less valid than yours, and you will not tolerate virtue signal-bullying about her infidelity enabling husband and you dumping her cheating a** son." ~ MonchichiSalt
"I would say ESH is more suitable here."
"The husband cheated, he's the default a**hole. The father-in-law helped his son cover up the cheating, so he's an enabling a**hole."
"The mother-in-law tried to push her daughter-in-law to forgive the cheating despite going ballistic when she thought her own husband was cheating, so she's a hypocritical a**hole. And finally we have the OP, the lying, mudslinging a**hole."
"All that being said... I'm on OP's side. What she did was wrong, but oh so cathartic." ~ DigiAirship
"ESH. Yeah, even if it wasn't the cleanest move, it made the point very clearly. If she's going to pressure someone to stay after infidelity, it's fair to ask how she handled the same situation. Sometimes people don't get it until it hits close to home." ~ marlowtiredagain
"ESH is the answer. Here are the reasons in order of least to worst bad."
"1. OP for lying to her MIL about her FIL having an affair. 2. MIL for telling her DIL to stay in the marriage and not talking to her own son about what he did to kill the marriage. 3. FIL for helping son cover up the affair. 4. Husband for cheating and everything that followed." ~ Longjumping-Lab-1916
"ESH... BUT... Honestly, I have done something similar once."
"A dear friend of mine wanted to cheat on his wife with me, and made the proposition. I said it's crazy that both tried the same move on the same friend on the same day. I asked him if it was planned. He stared at me for a moment and was like, 'Wait, my wife hit on you? When?'."
"I said she only just asked me if I'd meet up with her later and have sex, but I told her no because she had a man. And now here's that same man, asking me the same question."
"He started crying about how his wife's cheating, and I responded with, 'She's not, but now you know how it feels. Don't do that'."
"Sometimes, you just GOTTA hand those lessons out." ~ mollymolotov666
While OP's mother-in-law wasn't being empathetic, was lying to nuke her marriage the right call?
In the end, OP is the one who will have to live with her choices.
Revenge feels great in the moment, but sometimes guilt feels worse.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp