Most of us live with the comfort of knowing we will always have the love and support of our family.
Not everyone is so lucky, though.
Many people have challenging, sometimes fraught relationships with their families.
Even going so far as to cut off ties with them completely.
Redditor old_bald_fattie was one of those unlucky individuals who did not have a good relationship with his family, particularly his mother.
Eventually leading to the original poster (OP) being estranged from his family.
Much to his surprise, the OP's father reached out to him, urging him to make amends with his mother and rejoin the family.
Something the OP was completely uninterested in doing.
After being called "ungrateful" by his father, the OP took to the subReddit "Am I the A**hole Here" (AITAH).
While similar to the "Am I The A**Hole" (AITA) subReddit, AITAH allows Redditors to ask for advice on issues that are not permitted on AITA, such as asking for advice or posting about ending relationships. Nor are voting acronyms required or a final judgment declared.
The OP asked fellow Redditors:
"AITAH for refusing to make amends with my elderly mother after she told me 'you don't have a mother' to protect her favorite son?"
The OP explained why they had no interest in reconciling with their mother and family:
"Things don't get easier even when you're older."
"My mother used to go out of her way to protect her elder son, the favorite."
"A few years ago, he was an a-hole to my wife, and I had a fight with him."
"I expected the family to at least see how his harassment was unacceptable."
"My mother took his side as usual, and to get me to stop making her son look bad, she said, 'You don't have a mother, consider me dead."
"I took that to heart. I cut my family off, especially my mother."
"Now, years later, they don't want to reconcile."
"They want me to go back 'into the family fold' as to speak."
"My father explicitly said I'm not to open any topic or point any fingers."
"Just forget and come back."
"I asked, what about my brother's unacceptable behavior towards my wife?"
"'It was a misunderstanding."
"What about my mother's behavior?"
"She's your mother, she can say whatever she wants, you are an ungrateful son'."
"Thing is, the entire family has gone up in arms against me."
"Uncles, aunts, cousins."
"Anybody I used to be in touch with has stopped talking to me."
"They're all calling me a POS for not talking to my elderly mother."
"In our culture, parents are supposed to be treated as gods."
"I'm tired emotionally."
"I don't know if this is a hill to die on."
"They refuse to acknowledge my brother's behavior, and I was in the wrong for not handling things differently then."
"I'm standing by my wife, and everybody's calling me an AH."
"Am I?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in, with some using the AITA voting acronyms:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
Everyone agreed that this was absolutely a "hill to die on" and that it was probably better for the OP's mental and physical health to remain estranged from his family if they refused to acknowledge how he and his wife were treated:
"No, you are not the ah, they are, you did what a husband is supposed to do and protect your wife."-
Salt_Inflation1427
"NTA."
"This could be a hill to die on."
"Sounds like your family will always see you as second best."
"Well done for sticking up for yourself and your wife."- Traditional_Film_636
"Well, it's clear that you now have something they want."
"Did your wife have a child?"
"Did you get a new job with a high salary?"- TarzanKitty
"NTA - you gotta take care of you."
"They clearly aren't taking your thoughts and feelings into account, and someone needs to, even if it's just yourself."
"Don't concern yourself with the feelings of people who don't concern themselves with yours."-Trevors-Axiom-
"You've been without them in your life for a long time and have been just fine."
"Carry on ignoring them and forget they exist."
"I know culturally it's hard, but outside of your wife and children nobody matters."
"Extended family is often people you'd never talk to or be friends with if you weren't related."
"I know mine are."
"I never see them, and we haven't spoken in years."
"And I'm perfectly happy for it to remain that way."
"They are all a bunch of judgmental narcissists with whom I have nothing in common with."- Adelucas
"I mean, you have your family now."
"They were wrong."
"You and your wife can choose to forgive and forget, but the dynamic is not gonna change NTA."
"Family's can be toxic too."- Top-Customer1055
"NTAH."
"The birthing unit tore up her mom card and then pissed on it for good measure."
"Block everyone who supports her, full on scorched earth, and move forward with your wife in the peace of knowing you NEVER have to deal with their gaslighting and abuse again."
"As Gandalf said to Theoden, 'breathe the free air'."- DaYettiman22
"Your family sounds like mine - brother that's a Golden Child, mother who favors him above all others, and a father who goes along with it all."
"I got tired of being the scapegoat and finally walked away."
"Oh, I've made amends twice, but everything would go right back to the same behavior, only different situations."
"I walked away for good because my mental health was suffering greatly."
"No - you're not the AH."
"They are."
"Live your life."
"You deserve to be happy."- _PaisleyPosey_
"Remember the full phrasing of the adage."
"The blood of the covenant is thicker than the water of the womb."
"You are an adult."
"You choose your family now, based on the ways people show up for you, choose to be in your life, revel in your wins, console your losses."
"Genetics can be a part of that, but doesn't need to be."
"Go back to NC and block every last one of them."
"They've made their choice, and now it's your turn to make yours."
"NTA."- TicoSoon
"NTA."
"I hate that just because she is elderly, she is meant to get a free pass."
"Ditch the fam."- Altruistic-Bottle116
"What do these people bring to your life besides toxicity? What is worth you going back 'into the fold' for?"- AllAboutTheQueso
"Why are they pushing you to go back into the fold?"
"Does your mother need assistance, and is her 'true son' not willing to give it?"
"Are you financially well off, and do they expect you to pay your mother's way, at this stage of her life?"
"Is your mother terminally ill, and does she want you 'back', and does the rest of the family want you to play pretend, untill she passes, after which everyone can go back to pretending neither side exists?"
"The simple answer you can give them is 'What mother?'
"'She told me I don't have one, and I should consider her dead'."
"'I believed her'."
"'And I respect her wishes'.'
"NTA."
"But asking everyone that's harassing you to play pretend what the reason is, is not weird."- Baudica
"Your wife is your family."
"Parents, uncles, aunts… are your extended family."
"Stand your ground, stand by your wife because when you give in to your extended family, you're showing them that it's ok to disrespect your wife."-_twisted_ace_
"Die on the hill, my friend."
"Your family's behaviour towards you and most importantly, your wife, is not good enough."
"Culture aside, if it feels wrong, it IS wrong."
"Support the family you created, not the family who clearly does not care."- Kippa-King
"Tradition is just peer-pressured from dead people."
"You are allowed to say, I will not treat family this way and I choose to start new traditions."
"Treat others as you wish to be treated."- Neptune_Ferfer
"You've got along without them."
"Life is not missing anything as a result of their absence."
"Show them your metal and say 'no thanks, I'll keep things as they are. Have a nice life'."
"I had a MIL like that, too."
"Even in the hospital when she was dying, she refused to let my husband have a carton of milk sitting unused on her dinner tray, despite the fact he had been sitting by her bedside for 8 hours."
"She said, 'No, you can't have that. D might want it later. You know how it is when you're a parent'."
"D was 59 ….. Golden Balls bled her dry, and she could see no wrong in him."
"That statement broke my husband, and he didn't see her again before she died, and it seems she didn't care anyway."
"He, too, felt like a POS, but she had treated him like one for years, and he has guilt still but no regrets."
"He was a very good son, but she was too stupid-yes, stupid, blind, biased, ignorant-to realize what she was losing."
"It was the final statement that broke the camel's back."
"Protect your headspace - you come first every time in a situation like this."
"They do not get to go la la la la la with their fingers in their ears."
"They accept they are wrong and acknowledge and apologise or you remain NC."
"NTA."- buttersismantequilla
The fact that the OP's father took the initiative to reach out to the OP suggests that his family does miss him and wants him to be a part of it.
That doesn't mean the OP is in any way obligated to rejoin them after the way they treated him.
In order to properly make amends, all relevant parties need to seek and exchange forgiveness, and respect is something that is earned, not guaranteed.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp