Anyone who has dated someone with an emotionally imbalanced family dynamic can attest to how hard it can be to maintain that relationship, to feel fulfilled by it, and to even stay in it long-term, possibly while raising children.
Because when the family is already emotionally imbalanced, it's only going to get worse with more members added to it, cringed the users of the "Am I the A**hole?" (AITAH) subReddit.
Redditor EvelisseBloom had been dating a man for several years who clearly had a strong and intense relationship with his mother, and his mother had made it clear that no one would ever love him as much as she did.
But when she attended their anniversary dinner in a white dress and continued to assert that he would always be her favorite, the Original Poster (OP) decided to speak the truth with the entire family present.
She asked the sub:
"AITAH for calling my fiancé's mom 'obsessed' with him at dinner in front of everyone?"
The OP's anniversary dinner was not off to a good start.
"I'll be honest, I was already irritated before dinner even started because his mom always has to be involved in everything. She invited herself to our anniversary dinner, among others."
"We were celebrating four years together, and she showed up in a white dress. like deada** a literal bridal white floor-length dress and heels, and said she 'wanted to feel pretty too.'"
"I saw her and was already biting my tongue at that point."
When her future mother-in-law pined over her future husband, the OP spoke up.
"Anyway, we're all talking and laughing, and she cut me off mid-sentence to tell this long story about how when he was a baby, he'd cry if she left the room, and she used to sleep on the floor next to his crib."
"Okay, whatever, but then later, she touched his face and said, 'You'll always be my favorite boy. No one will ever love you like I do.'"
"Everyone kinda laughed it off, but I was stunned, because she was not even being subtle anymore?! She's clearly obsessed with him."
"I didn't even think, it just came out of my mouth. I said. 'Do you even hear yourself? You sound obsessed. He's your son, not your boyfriend.'"
The OP was surprised by how the evening turned out.
"It was silent, like a fork hitting a plate silent. His brother literally choked on his wine."
"His mom looked like I slapped her. She said I was being 'disrespectful and dramatic' and started crying, saying, 'I've loved him longer than anyone,' and 'You don't understand mother-son bonds.'"
"He took her side, too, and said I was rude and 'ruined the mood' (of our anniversary dinner, keep in mind, which is apparently the time for a date night with his mother)."
"He didn't even check on me when I got up and left. I took an Uber home. He hasn't texted me."
"My best friend says I went too far and should have kept this to myself, but I don't know. It's been two days, and all I feel is more angry. Like, am I supposed to compete with this woman forever?? Am I supposed to be second to someone who acts like she's his ex trying to win him back??"
"I don't know, I'm spiraling. Did I cross the line or finally say what no one else would?"
"AITAH?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
- NTA: Not the A**hole
- YTA: You're the A**hole
- ESH: Everybody Sucks Here
- NAH: No A**holes Here
Some cautioned the OP against dating, let alone marrying, the momma's boy of the family.
"OP, don't marry him; he's the golden child of a 'boy mom.'"
"Your fiancé isn't correcting her; he's correcting YOU! So, what did we learn?"
"1. She openly favors one son in front of the other. What's that gonna be like with your kids?"
"2. Your fiancé IS OKAY WITH IT. Doesn't he care about his brother's feelings? No? Then he lacks empathy and is a potential narcissist (because golden kids run that risk)."
"No one in the family is willing to stand up to her. They're all either crazy too, or else she terrifies them. And your fiancé is now giving you the silent treatment."
"How many more red flags do you need? I'm sorry that you've wasted four years, but better than having to get divorced later."
"Let him marry his mommy. NTA." - Naive-Stable-3581
"I feel horrible for the brother, but I'm sure he's also far better adjusted than the OP's future husband, who is enmeshed with his mother. Freud called men like the OP's partner 'Oedipal complexes,' and only therapy can change them. But if he wants you to apologize and is giving you the silent treatment... he won't be going to therapy any time soon." - 2dogs1life
"I would never marry a momma's boy. It ruins them. Mom is doing him such a disservice in life. OP will resent both of them in due time, and she will lose any attraction to him. Just end it now. She'll convince him you were a walking red flag, but you'll be better off." - jessiezell
"NTA. I was once with a mama's boy, and things got abusive where they teamed up on me. He never took my side, no matter how outrageous her behavior became. Think of the things she'll do to ruin your wedding, when you have kids, more future celebrations; they do not respect you." - Boobear0810
"He took her side... Run. You will never be the most important person to him; he will always choose his mother over you. Is this how you want to spend the rest of your life?" - Visual-Lobster6625
"NTA. But this is a massive compatibility checkpoint."
"This isn't just about dinner. This is about the rest of your life. Do you want to marry someone who lets his mom compete with you, belittle your place in his life, and walk all over your boundaries?"
"You're not spiraling. You're waking up. Don't ignore that instinct." - Lost_Preparation_835
"Consider yourself lucky that he has not reached out to you and walk away. This is exactly your future until she dies. He did not put a stop to it, and that is totally on him. He deserves his mother and not you."
"You only have one thing you can give him that she doesn't... That one thing, being an incubator, will be your only purpose, and you will always come after she does. Her happiness will always be more important than yours."
"You have been dealing with this three years too long already. Don't waste any more of this one and only life you have with a partner that takes up for his mother acting like his girlfriend." - different-take4u
"You broke up with him. And you should. He's a momma's boy, and she has an unhealthy attachment."
"You never stood a chance. No woman will. Stop chasing him or waiting for him to step up, accept that you broke up with him, and move on." - AdAccomplished6870
Others thought the brother "choking on his wine" spoke volumes about the family dynamic.
"'His brother literally choked on the wine.' Bro had always wanted to say what you said... I bet he was secretly cheering you on." - Enough-Owl-4301
"I'm just cringing about her saying, 'You'll always be my favorite boy,' with her other son right there. Tell me there's a golden child without telling me there's a golden child." - CovertQuests
"I had to stop and reread that sentence because it was at that point I realized that woman had just said to one of her sons, 'You'll always be my favorite boy. No one will ever love you like I do,' with her other son sitting RIGHT THERE."
"Jes*s f**king chr**t, that poor brother. I imagine he's spent his whole life hearing language like that from his own mother. That's just f**king cruel." - Maxamillion-X72
"Saying that he was her favorite when the mother became the full-on AH 100 percent."
"And OP, just leave this situation. The favored child is also the entitled child, trust me, I am the not-favored child, and my brother is obnoxious, and cannot even see it, and also single. Repeatedly."
"This dude does not even see it, and will always need the 'most loved' title. Eww. Run!" - Street-Length9871
"He took her side. Red flags."
"I spent 20 years married to a mama's boy. We had children together. Not once did he ever stand up for me to mommy. Once I left, he started a smear campaign using the false things mommy used to say about me."
"It dawned on me that he agreed with mommy about me, and he probably did the entirety of our relationship. My wonderful kids are the only reason I don't consider these 20 years a waste."
"If I were in your shoes, given what I know, I would have run the first time he chose mommy over me. I deserved better, and so do you." - theangryprof
"'You'll always be my favorite boy. No one will ever love you like I do...'"
"With the brother sitting right next to you guys? Wow, the level is so creepy as f**k. He took his mother's side and made his bed. I'd nope out of that relationship real fast."
"Sorry, OP. There's plenty of fish out there. Just keep on watching out for those red flags... NTA." - RedditMiniMinion
"He's not marriage material. Most other men would make her stop before it came to this. But there are those men who are so enmeshed with a clingy, emotionally incestuous mommy that they just can't function in a real partnership with a woman."
"It sounds like he may be one of those guys. I think you should not call him. Let him make the first move. Take this opportunity to think about what you really want in life. NTA. At all." - EbbIndependent5368
Fellow Redditors were left cringing over what the OP witnessed at dinner and what she likely had witnessed in the years that she had dated her almost-husband.
Since he'd sided with his mother and had not bothered to call the OP, it was clear where his loyalties were, and it seemed like the perfect opportunity for the OP to start fresh and find someone who valued her and would take it side when it mattered.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp