Parenting involves a carful hand between helping your children and letting them do things themselves. But while this seems like difficult advice when dealing with young kids, it becomes so much harder when your children are adults.
Redditor Critical_Value1511 just wants his son to consider the financial consequences of his actions. But the original poster (OP) is being called the bad guy for what he said.
Should OP just give in to what his son is asking for, or was he right to respond how he did?
To find out, OP decided to ask the "Am I the A**hole" (AITA) subReddit the titular question.
"AITA for not giving my son part of his trust fund early because he refuses to sign a prenup with his fiancee?"
And OP's situation has people split on the response.
"Some background: I have 4 kids. My eldest John (27M[ale]), was with my first wife who died when he was 5. I eventually remarried and got two step-daughters, Lisa (25F[emale]) and Ann (18F). Then my second wife and I had Mike (13M)."
"My wife and I made sure to give them comfortable lives. When John and Lisa graduated from university, we gifted them condo units. We will do the same when Ann and Mike graduate."
"Also, all of them have trust funds that will be released when they turn 30."
"I'm quite proud of my kids. John and Lisa graduated from top universities. John has a high-paying job as an engineer while Lisa pursued a master's degree in business while she worked in marketing."
"Eventually, she started her own marketing consulting firm while being a part-owner of a spa."
"John recently got engaged to his girlfriend of 2 years and they want to get married by the end of this year. She seems nice."
"However, she doesn't earn as much as him. My son spends a lot of money on her, on dates and expensive gifts. I understand that it's his money and he can spend it however he wants."
"She also moved in with him in the condo that I gave him, and as far as I know, she doesn't pay her share of utilities and association fees. And now John is asking to get part of his trust fund so he could use it for the wedding since his fiancee doesn't have much money to contribute for their wedding."
"Now here's where I might be the a**hole. I told him I'd release part of his trust fund early if he draws up a prenup with her."
"He got angry and told me I was being unfair because I released half of Lisa's trust fund last year to help put up her business. He told me that I was playing favorites."
"I told him that Lisa did something worthwhile with her trust fund, and while a wedding is worthwhile, I told him it doesn't seem safe to use his fund for a wedding to a girl 'who doesn't bring much to the table'."
"I told him that I just wanted him to have some security by drawing up a prenup. He got angrier and said I was implying that his fiancee is a gold-digger."
"My wife and the rest of the family refuse to take sides. AITA?"
From OP's perspective, John is not protecting himself by refusing a prenup, and using part of his inheritance to pay for a wedding just puts him out money.
On the other hand, John sees that his sister got access to her funds early, setting a precedent. On top of that, his fiancée has been accused of being a gold digger.
Who is right and who is wrong here?
On Reddit, the users of the board judged OP for refusing to release some funds from John's trust without a prenuptial agreement by including one of the following in their response:
- NTA – Not the A**hole
- YTA – You're the A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everybody Sucks Here
The board was pretty well split on the reasonings, though there was more agreement that OP was wrong.
Whether they think John will have access to the funds anyway, and this just hurts OP's relationship with him, or that OP was right to ask John to get a prenuptial agreement but didn't have to make the comment about his fiancée, OP was acting like a jerk.
And people easily agreed on that basic point, even if they were divided on why.
"I don't think you're the a**hole for the condition of the prenup in order to have early access to his trust fund, but I think YTA for saying his fianceé 'doesn't bring much to the table.'"
"Why do you feel that way about her? Solely because she makes less money than your son?" - lihzee
"Your son John is 27. That means he's going to get the full trust fund amount in 3 years."
"Unless there's a really compelling reason to believe that John's fiancee is not trustworthy, is this really a wise move? You can really harm your relationship with your son by saying what you've said."
"Unless it is clear that there is a substantial risk to justify this, I don't think it's a good idea. It's just 3 years difference."
"Without knowing more about John's fiancee, it's impossible to say how reasonable you are being, but I'm going to guess that if you had good info that would indicate she is a likely gold digger, you would have included it."
"Judgment: YTA." - Cartwright_James
"YTA. Not for having reservations necessarily. Although this does feel like classism because her earning potential doesn't seem to meet your requirements."
"-it doesn't seem safe to use his fund for a wedding to a girl 'who doesn't bring much to the table'.-"
"This right here is the main reason you're an AH"
"Some people here will say you are within your legal right to withhold the money, but this is about morality. You've given no info about her character, you've only said she doesn't earn as much."
"You want her to seem like a gold digger, but you're the one who is all about the money." - Accurate-Fisherman68
"You're implying his fiancée is a gold digger. That being said, as a family law attorney, I'm certainly aware of how much protection a prenup could grant your son."
"I think it's a wise idea, and it sounds like you approached it the wrong way. At the end of the day, if he needs the money that badly he can always wait until he's 30."
"You're not wrong, but YTA for being insensitive and pretentious in your explanation of why." - ErisianImpulse
"Most new businesses fail. What conditions did you put on Lisa's money to make sure she wasn't going to lose it all?"
"The prenup wouldn't even affect the money you'd be releasing, since it's being used to pay for the wedding. So what you're wanting to do is control John's financial decisions regarding his own money."
"And holy moly, you're referring to your future DIL as a girl 'who doesn't bring much to the table' just because she has less money???"
"That is judgmental as f*** and completely misses the point of what a relationship is supposed to be."
"YTA." - My_genx_life
There's something to be said that this situation isn't going to apply to most of us. Between being able to gift his children condos, and providing them with trust funds, most people aren't going to be in this financial bracket.
Which honestly makes it a little difficult to provide objective criticism.
"Am I too poor for this one lol" - HeckinHecksonHeck
"Right? Imagine being gifted an apartment, or even having a trust fund lol" - abbles1er
"I have a trust fund for my kids setup. Its in a jar. It has coins in it. Its on a shelf..." - Various_Counter_9569
"I was thinking of what to say and this just brings it home to me. I can't really comment cause it's an issue outside of my realm."
"Although I have seen many divorces via friends and family. A lot of them get messy. So I generally tell people get a prenup since divorce rates are at what 60% or such."
"If you can't decided on a prenup while in love then you'll probably have other issue with money or such." - darkicedragon7
"Living in south FL where the housing situation is horrible… the thought that other people could be gifted a condo makes me feel a lil sick lol.
"Good for them but man that would change my life so drastically. The situation here is just awful." - LyricalLinds
"**Minimum wage has left the chat**" - TheShawnWray
"God what a mood" - syntheticat7
"I'm too poor to worry about silly squabbles that rich people have." - leisuremann
Overall, the consensus was that OP was the bad guy, bare minimum for how he talked about John's fiancée. That said, he should consider if this is the hill he wants to kill his relationship with his son on.
John will have access to the trust fund soon enough, and has a good job making good money. If he and his fiancée can't figure things out if the worst were to happen, at least OP warned him beforehand. He should give John the money for the wedding.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp