Sometimes people really can't take a hint.
How many times do people have to be retold something?
And why?
Listen and learn.
We'd be better off for it.
Case in point...
Redditor curious_georgie456 wanted to discuss her story for some feedback. So naturally she came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
She asked:
"AITA for publicly shaming a 'friend'"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I (21F[emale]) was adopted practically at birth from South Korea."
"I was raised in the US by a white couple."
"I grew up knowing nothing about my culture."
"When I started attending college 3 years ago, I joined a Korean club."
"It was mostly about learning the language, the culture and the cuisine."
"There I made a female friend, let's call her Anna."
"Anna is white, but she is super into Kpop and Kdramas."
"Nothing wrong with that."
"Then a year later I was able to get into contact with my birth family in Korea."
"I went there for 2 weeks and met everyone."
"It was also pure luck that my older male cousin was going to come study in my college."
"Well he arrived about a month ago, I introduced him to Anna and she started calling him Oppa."
"It's a name you use with older male relatives or very close male friends."
"And it has a cultural significance."
"It basically means that you are either related or very close, and that they are more or less responsible for you to an extent."
"Well he is shy (not that confident about his English)."
"So he asked me to explain to her gently that she shouldn't call him that. Which I did."
"She would apologize, then do it again."
"I had a private talk with her more than 10 times."
"It was making my cousin very uncomfortable."
"So when she did it again yesterday atg a party I just went off on her in public."
"I can't remember the words I used exactly, but I basically told her that she is not living in a kdrama."
"My cousin is not her prop to use to live her fantasies."
"And she is appropriating a culture she neither belongs to, nor understands."
"She burst out crying and left in a hurry. "
"And now people are calling me an AH for shaming her in public."
"AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA?:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors declared our OP was NOT the A**hole.
It's a tricky situation.
Let's hear some thoughts...
"NTA. You talked to her about it privately more than 10 times and she kept doing it, so it was obviously intentional."
"Nothing was going to make this girl stop but being publicly called out for using your cousin as her prop."
"That's exactly what she was doing." ~ efm270
"I'm really thinking it is a corollary of 'it's never wrong to publicly embarrass a racist.'"
"It is never wrong to publicly embarrass a fetishist (especially after you have privately spoken to them multiple times)."
"It seems to me that the racist and the fetishist are just two sides of the same coin."
"Someone who is trying to fit another person into a script they wrote based on the other person's race, ethnicity, sexuality, etc."
"And, of course, NTA." ~ Downtown_Evidence_46
"NTA - If she didn't want to be called out at a party then she shouldn't have said it at a party, not after so many discreet warnings."
"That said, the optics of your response look terrible."
"The observers at the party didn't see the lead-up so they only know you unloaded on her."
"When doing this type of thing it's more effective to look the offender in the eye."
"But tone down the emotion and choose words for the onlookers."
"Ask yourself... hat do these other people need to know to understand how much of an a**hole she's being?" ~ doublestitch
"Even if it is common, he made it known he was uncomfortable with her calling him Oppa."
"And she acknowledged that, then turns around and continues."
"That's not misunderstanding."
"That's just full on ignoring someone else's comfort and boundary because she seems to think that either she is living a kdrama or he's her prop. NTA."
"She could've just called him a Ching-gu (friend in Korean) & he probably would've been fine with that." ~ RndmIntrntStranger
"I would advise next time you have to do that."
"To try get people on your side start with something like 'Anna I have told you a ton of times already and you promised to stop, this makes my cousin uncomfortable...' and then the rest."
"That way you are giving context and a lot of people will realize that if you asked in private a ton of times and she keeps at it."
"You were left with no other choice."
"Some people will still call you the AH because God forbid that we shame those that should be ashamed of what they are doing. NTA." ~ SkyLightk23
"NTA - As a lover of Kdramas and Kpop myself, I thought people were self aware enough to not use Oppa/Noona if you are a foreigner."
"It's just not the same and cringy."
"You do not have that level of closeness to be able to use those honorifics!!"
"Enjoy other cultures but don't forget to respect them!" ~ nymmyy
"NTA. Her little weaponized white tears are forever gonna make her the victim according to people."
"You can't win in that aspect."
"Good on you for finally having enough and standing up for your cousin, some people only step back when they get publicly shamed." ~cultqueennn
"NTA ,and as a fellow Korean, your response brings me joy LOL."
"I feel like as K-dramas and K-pop have become increasingly popular in the West, it's also resulted in an increasing amount of non-Koreans (mostly white people in my experience) overstepping their boundaries."
"Or devolving into weird fetishists."
"Like I once had a girl tell me she only dates Korean men now because "K-dramas ruined regular men forever" for her."
"So believe me, there's been many times I've wanted to tell someone basically the same thing you said to her."
"It might seem like a dramatic response to others, but when you've had to deal with something like that so often."
"It really doesn't feel that unreasonable." ~ mobpsychokiller
"NTA. Sounds like you were overdramatic."
"You're not in a drama either."
"But at that point, the principle of it-you're certainly justified in calling her out, on the spot, publicly, when she continued to disrespect such a simple boundary." ~ opinionreservoir
"Sometimes 'fans' get too overexcited especially if they suddenly see people who originated from South Korea."
"This does not exempt her however from disrespecting the country's culture especially when people are getting uncomfortable and you asking politely (several times) for her to stop."
"NTA, you were left with no choice and it may be a good wake up call for her."
"I might have been dramatic too if I was in your position." ~ singleusagi
"The ingrained racism, the arrogance of her clearly believing that her 'version' of the word made it an acceptable social greeting is sadly a reflection of the arrogance many feel."
"It's you who is misunderstanding their efforts type of a thing."
"When in fact it's not."
"Anna was trying to push herself into your biological family and use terms that don't have a direct version in english."
"And so she can't comprehend the responsibility of such a title."
"Or the embarassment of its appropriation."
"It may go better if by one asks or it comes up again to say... you are causing real offense when you using that term."
"When we've asked you not to and explained its true meaning in Korean culture."
"On a side note, congrats on finding your birth family and having what sounds like an amazing opportunity to grow roots in your birth culture whilst sharing your nurtured culture with bio relatives."
"It sounds like it's working for you and your family, I think that's wonderful and special." ~ HereComesTheSun000
"NAH. She wasn't overdramatic, especially since she's addressed the issue many times in private already and the friend knows it makes others uncomfortable."
"After a certain point (or immediately) it does become cringe worthy and enough is enough."
"Someone else's culture is not a costume literally or figuratively both in words or dress."
"As a person of color from a culture that has many words used like this I'd react the same way if someone did this. NTA." ~ tn596
"NTA. I have an older male Korean friend who said I could call him that but to be honest I still don't feel comfortable doing it."
"Not because I don't respect the culture but it just isn't my place to use the term."
"She has a delusional mind set about the Korean culture and what it actually is." ~ dragonborne123
Well OP, according to Reddit, you did what must be done.
Some people need a loud talking to sometimes.
Hopefully this is a learning lesson for all.
Have fun in school.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp