Sharing finances in a relationship isn't always easy.
Even if people have their own separate money in tandem with a split account, shared money is shared money.
And when big expenses come along, they can cause some trouble.
Money matters are always touchy.
Redditor ARandomStringOfWords wanted to discuss their experience and get some feedback, so naturally, they came to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subreddit.
They asked:
"AITA? Should I have to pay for a birthday I am excluded from attending?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"My partner's mother decided she wants to have her big anniversary birthday in another state, going for a week and staying somewhere fancy."
"She's said she'll pay for everything, but the only people invited are her children and her partner."
"Fair enough."
"It's her big day, and while being excluded hurts, I can understand her wanting to only have those closest to her there."
"Here's the but..."
"My partner wants to be the big man and pay for it, or at least split it with his siblings."
"I am very much not OK with that."
"We have joint finances, which means by definition half of that very large sum would be coming from my hip pocket."
"His family is big on the whole 'no, let *me* pay' game, and normally I'm happy to play it, but I just don't feel it's OK for me to be told I'm not invited and then have him expect me to contribute."
The OP was left to wonder:
"AITA for not wanting to financially contribute towards a holiday I'm being excluded from attending?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed in on some options to the question, AITA:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors declared that OP was NOT the A**hole.
"NTA. Forget about paying for this trip."
"Why is he even going?"
"My husband would not attend a vacation I was being intentionally excluded from."
"There would never be a thought that it would be an immediate hard decline." ~ florida_lmt
"Not invited is an incredible slap in the face; it is simply not how things are going."
"Married people, and many other types of relationships, become a single unit; unless there's some very good reason, like it's a girls' weekend or whatever, you don't get to invite one but not the other."
"Getting married is also joining the family."
"We fostered and adopted, so get to see this up close with some of our extended family, or theirs, and it's deeply upsetting and insulting how many consider only blood and not any other type of relationship to be real."
"OP is NTA, and I would have put up more of a fuss, not just the finances." ~ shoobe01
"NTA, but the real problem is your partner, not his mom."
"Separate finances now."
"And reconsider this relationship if he thinks you should have to pay for part of his mom's trip."
"If she's paying for the trip, who goes is up to her."
"His wanting to take money from your joint funds is a big problem, though." ~ gremlinofspite
"I kind of agree."
"At least separate savings accounts for things like this."
"He wants to be the 'big man?'"
"He can take it out of his fun money- not their joint account."
"Absolutely NTA." ~ Healthy-Detective326
"NTA. If your partner wants to pay for it, he should, but it can't come out of your joint finances."
"Or if it has to, you should be able to take the same sum out to spend on a trip or something else just for you." ~ Poekienijn
"NTA. I can certainly understand why you don't want to pay for something where you're not welcome.'
"If you have only joint finances, I'd tell your husband you want to balance things out by spending the same amount for something for yourself, like a trip to your parents or something hobby-related." ~ Heavy-Equipment8389
"NTA, your M[other]-I[n]-L[aw] is a grown adult who can't have her children's partners attend a holiday because she needs all attention on her birthday."
"She needs to get a grip and realise she's not the centre of the universe."
"If your partner takes that money, then make sure you take the same amount of money and shout your own friends or family a week away without inviting him."
"Make it a really epic trip."
"Far better than hers."
"If he complains, ask him how it's any different from him." ~ Nice_Option1598
"It's not about the party, it's about OP's partner wanting to use joint funds to pay for it (not just his part but the whole thing), when OP is not invited."
"I can understand OP feeling that she is paying to be excluded."
"To be clear here, MIL is stating that she is paying so that she can control the guest list."
"And then she may or may not be counting on 1 or more of her children to insist on paying for her."
"Thus, she gets her children to herself without in-laws or grandkids, and won't pay a dime. NTA." ~ 1962Michael
"NTA. He is okay with you being excluded AND he wants you to pay for it too?"
"Big fat nopes all around." ~ hotmesssorry
"Anyone wanna clue me in on what an anniversary birthday is???"
"NTA, you shouldn't be asked or expected to pay for an event you're not welcome at."
"Your husband is kinda an ah for thinking it's fair for you to help pay for it when you aren't gonna be there." ~ SigSauerPower320
"Surely you don't join ALL of your finances?"
"Surely you keep your own bank accounts as well?"
"If he wants to pay for some or all of this trip and birthday event for his Mum, it should come out of his bank account, not out of your joint one."
"But if he wants to take a large sum out of your joint account for something that excludes you, then tell him you will take the same sum out for something that is personal to you and excludes him."
"That may hopefully make him see how ridiculous he is being."
"Especially if your joint funds don't support both withdrawals." ~ Pretty_Outcome_307
"NTA, whatever he removes from your joint account for the party, take the same amount out and put it into your own personal account that he doesn't have access to." ~ AdFar6570
"NTA - odd behavior from your MIL to exclude you, as I'm going to assume you are in a pretty serious long-term relationship if you have joint finances, I don't really understand why she wouldn't invite you or other siblings' partners either." ~ smorgiie
"NTA. How, just how, did I know you were female and your problem partner would be male before I started reading?"
"It's always the momma's boys letting this kind of a**holery happen."
"Excluding you was a choice, since you're at the stage where you've got joint finances, I'm assuming you've been together for a while."
"Again, excluding you was a choice."
"Don't let this kind of behaviour slide, OP." ~ kidstrongbow
"If you have joint finances, you can't really tell him what he is going to spend his money on."
"If he insists on paying for this huge trip, you should book one just for yourself for the same week. Miraval is a lovely all-inclusive wellness resort I would highly recommend."
"You'll have no trouble spending just as much as he is. NAH." ~ GrammaIsAWh*re
"Nope, NTA. The entitlement."
"I would never do something for MIL, as in she would be banned from my house and kids."
"Your spouse can pay out of their money, not the family money."
"They do not have enough- they can get a loan from a sibling or sell something of their own." ~ stuckinnowhereville
"Do you guys have one joint account and that's it?"
"You guys could think about having additional individual accounts where a small % of what you earn goes into them so you can cover costs like these."
"My missus and I put 70% of our incomes into a joint account, and we keep 30% for ourselves."
"All this, to say, he should be paying from somewhere where your finances are not connected. NTA." ~ majoombu
"If you're already at the joint finances stage, then you should also be invited."
"And he should have been insulted when you were not. NTA."
"Not even a little bit."
"You can't play power plays when you don't have the money to back it up." ~ Aggressive_Cup8452
"NTA. You shouldn't have to contribute to an event that you are not welcome at, but… he must certainly have his own personal money that is not family but earmarked for his personal use?"
"And… I assume you do as well?"
"If not, then I suggest you set that up ASAP."
"We all need some sort of financial independence." ~ daysalou
"Take out whatever you put into that joint account, and open a separate account."
"He doesn't get to play generous with YOUR money."
"Especially when you're being excluded. NTA." ~ Cat1832
"Absolutely NTA."
"If he insists on paying, or paying a share, make sure you withdraw an equal amount from your joint account and put it into a separate account just for you."
"Better yet, tell him he's being a selfish idiot and enabling his mother's ill-treatment of you, and that he cannot use joint funds for this." ~ Alien-lifeform666
"Recently widowed and maintained separate accounts from my husband until his demise."
"Combining accounts before marriage is not smart, OP. NTA." ~ Flimsy-Call-3996
Reddit is with you, OP.
You are allowed to have these feelings.
If you can't go, why should you pay for it?
Giving a little as a gift is one thing, by shelling out a huge amount of money is another.
Hopefully, you and your partner can come to an understanding that makes you both happy.
Good Luck.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp