Kids are wonderful, but there's no denying that having kids irrevocably changes a person's life forever.
And harsh as it might sound, it's no one else's responsibility to accommodate their new family life, pointed out the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor No_Membership2945 was planning a birthday weekend away, and with travel, gaming, and drinks involved, it was clearly an adults-only type of weekend.
When their old friend, who was a father now, insisted on bringing his young son on the trip, the Original Poster (OP) sympathized with him but refused to change the rules for him, even if it meant that he wouldn't be able to go.
They asked the sub:
"Am I overreacting by telling my friend that he can't bring his kid on my adults-only birthday trip?"
The OP was planning a fun, obviously adults-only, weekend away for their birthday.
"I’m planning a weekend away for my birthday with a group of close friends."
"We rented a house, planned to drink, stay up late, play games, and generally have an adults-only weekend."
One of their friends wanted to bring their young son along for the weekend.
"One of my friends recently became a dad and told us he’s bringing his two-year-old, because his wife wants a weekend to herself and he 'can’t just not be a parent for two days.'"
"I told him I love his kid, but this trip was clearly planned as an adult getaway, and having a child there changes the whole vibe for everyone. He said if his kid can’t come, then he can’t come."
"I said that’s fine, but he doesn’t get to change the nature of the trip for everyone else because of his childcare situation."
The friend group was divided over the boundaries that the OP set for the new dad.
"Now, some of my friends think I’m being insensitive and excluding him for being a parent."
"Others agree it’s unreasonable to bring a kid to an adult birthday weekend."
"He says I’m acting like his life shouldn’t have changed just because he has a family now."
"Am I being too harsh? Insensitive?"
"AIO?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
- NOR: Not Overreacting
- YOR: You're Overreacting
Some agreed that children change the whole vibe of an event, and bringing a young child for the weekend would impact all of the OP's plans.
"Life does change when you have a kid, and that means you don't get to just keep partying and drinking whenever you want, nor should he want to expose his two-year-old to that."
"Absolutely, his life should have changed, and part of that change is that he doesn't get to be included in every adult trip because he has a kid. He absolutely should be a good dad, and that means not going to every party your friends throw."
"Just because he has a kid doesn't mean their lives should have to accommodate that." - jypzirium
"NOR. Who wants a kid around when everyone is gonna be drinking and trying to have fun?"
"It sucks for him that he can't be a part of the trip, as I'm sure he was looking forward to it, but I feel like, as a parent, it's kinda what he signed up for, to miss certain events when needed."
"Also, why does the wife need a weekend to herself the same weekend as your birthday trip? I feel like this couple could come to a solution that gets the wife a break AND allows the guy to come on the trip child-free if they both wanted that." - teeleeyuh
"He’s the one acting like his life shouldn’t change. Sorry. He can’t bring his child to an adult weekend. That’s how his life has changed."
"He needs to accept it and deal with it. HIS life changed. Not yours." - Dangerous_Emu47
"NOR. You’re not excluding him for being a parent. Not wanting kids present doesn’t mean excluding parents."
"He can arrange alternative childcare if he wants to attend, or speak to his wife to see if plans can shift. Or he can accept that he’ll have to miss this one. None of his options should include blaming you." - embopbopbopdoowop
"The OP wrote, 'He says I’m acting like his life shouldn’t have changed just because he has a family now.' NOR. His life has changed dramatically, and he has to accept that."
"Bringing a two-year-old to a birthday party with a clear intention of being an adult weekend is an absolute d**k move."
"He can’t expect everyone else to adapt to his situation that has changed. He has to live with the fact that he is a father and sometimes will miss things he wouldn’t have without kids."
"He is the one who is overreacting." - Uzumaki_Thomas
"He seems to be acting like HE thinks his life shouldn't have to change. OP and their friends are accepting that his life has changed, and one thing that's changed is that it may be that he's not able to go off for a long weekend of drinking with his mates." - ProfessorYaffle1
"Life does change when you have a child, and by that, I mean the parents' lives. Speaking from experience, I’m skipping out on a birthday trip for one of my closest friends, because even though she’s said she’d be fine with me bringing my child, who would be one-and-a-half years old by the time of the trip, it takes away from the massive 30th bash she wanted the trip to be."
"NOR, OP. If the friend wants to give the wife a break, then he needs to sit this one out, not expect everyone to change the nature of the trip, because doing his child would do exactly that, no offense to his child or his fatherhood; it's just the truth." - MelanisticMermaid
Others reassured the OP that it wasn't their job to accommodate their friend's life now that he had a child.
"NOR. The weekend was originally planned as a birthday getaway for adults only."
"Your friend should ask the grandparents to help with the kid, not ask you to bring him on the trip. I’m honestly surprised some friends are okay with it, but maybe they’re scared of speaking up? I don't know."
"I don’t doubt your friend’s wife would feel overwhelmed, but asking her husband to take a kid almost sounds like either a punishment for your friend for leaving her for the weekend, or as a way to get him to stay home with her and the kids (because most guys would just stay home if their wife said take the kid, instead of asking if their kid can join the debauchery)." - trapmoneyjennE
"It’s irresponsible of him to even try to bring a young child to an adult party. He should know better. He’s been a dad for two years. That’s not 'recently' becoming a dad." - Dangerous_Emu47
"NOR. You don’t rent a place and spend all that time planning with friends to host a literal toddler."
"Maybe your friend’s wife needs a break. He should help her and take the child to the park and catch up with you later."
"Absolutely no way would I allow a two-year-old baby to my drinking partying birthday bash. He is being inappropriate, not you." - kermitsmasher
"OP is 100% NOR."
"I bet his friend's wife is annoyed that she never gets time to herself and with her friends, and this guy is going to shove his kid off to one or many of his friends to play babysitter while he gets hammered."
"I have had this exact same thing happen to me before. Some parents really can be so irresponsible and lousy. Like, tell me you weren't ready to have kids without telling me you weren't ready to have kids. But it's not my responsibility to care for your kid while you figure it out." - Kamisamamiss
"NOR. He can sit this one out."
"As parents, there are just some things you don't get to do until your kids are either old enough to join in or be left with a sitter/alone. Goes with the territory, your request is reasonable." - NightVisionsII
"I am currently on my birthday trip with my two-year-old niece in tow."
"We changed everything to accommodate her. We changed where we went, we changed the resort packages we got, and our days are centered around her nap times."
"The difference here is I KNEW this was going to happen and AGREED to it!"
"OP, your friend is the selfish one for trying to manipulate you into changing what you want for him and his needs. His wife is incredibly selfish for trying to turn your birthday trip into her weekend without parenting."
"NOR." - lesem0
The subReddit could sympathize with the friend for still wanting to go for the OP's birthday weekend trip and wanting to feel included in things, but the truth of the matter was, he was still very much invited and welcome in his friend group, but there would be events that he wouldn't be able to attend if he couldn't come up with childcare for his son.
He was technically totally welcome to the OP's birthday weekend, but since the weekend itinerary was not child-friendly, he either needed to make other plans for his son, or he needed to make peace with the fact that he could have fun plans with his son instead of going on the trip.
That was no one's responsibility but his own, and trying to put the blame on the OP was as far from a good birthday gift as a person could get.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp