Certain conversations always have boundaries.
Don't they?
If someone says... "I don't want to talk about it," you leave it alone.
Right?
Or you persist to varying... windy consequences.
Maybe silence is best.
Case in point...
Redditor throwa67694 wanted to discuss his story for some feedback. So naturally he came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
He asked:
"AITA for forcing out a fart to get my mom to stop asking my girlfriend invasive questions infront of the whole family?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I know what it sounds like but I swear it's a desperate situation."
"So I (23 M[ale]) have been with my girlfriend (22 F[emale]) for 7 months."
"She has a visible scar on her neck and she hates to be asked about it and hates to tell the story behind it."
"Believe it or not I don't have the story yet but I'm waiting til she's comfortable to share."
"She met my family several times and of course... mom and aunts ask her about her scar... like 3-4 times in just a couple of hours."
"Then on dinner, then during movie time. etc."
"It got bothersome and my girlfriend would look uncomfortable and I could just tell that the question itself brings her sadness."
"I told my mom to stop asking such invasive questions about the scar and every time she'd say 'okay, won't ask I promise' but then she would turn around and do it again."
"On Mother's Day my girlfriend and I attended dinner at mom's."
"We where sitting in the living room and my mom goes to ask my girlfriend about the scar again."
"This time with a bigger audience because the whole family was there."
"My girlfriend said she'd rather not talk but mom kept cornering her and kept asking her in yes/no form."
"I was sitting next to mom and forced a loud fart in an attempt to take pressure and attention away from my girlfriend and get mom to switch her focus to something else."
"I was like 'whoops' and the family started laughing."
"M
"It got awkward, not gonna lie."
"But I was desperate and couldn't really yell at mom to stop and start a fight on Mother's Day."
"So I thought of this instead of making a scene."
"She pulled me into the kitchen and scolded me for what I did after I admitted that I did it intentionally."
"She called me childish and said that if I didn't want her to bring up my girlfriend's scar then I should've said... but I did!!!!"
"I swear like a 100 times."
"Anyways... my girlfriend and I left and my girlfriend couldn't stop laughing in the car."
"Unfortunately dad was upset too saying I behaved poorly and childishly in front of the extended family and told me to grow up."
"AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA?:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors declared our OP was NOT the A**hole.
It's a tricky situation.
Let's hear some thoughts...
"LOL. NTA for using your AH to make a point." ~ Sword_Of_Storms
"Responses are all highly hilarious but the serious issue is that girlfriend is now highly sensitive and will likely not want to be in OP's family's presence again."
"OP needs to have an ultimatum talk with his mother along the lines of - I am not the one being rude and childish here."
"You are the one being rude for continuing to press this issue and make gf uncomfortable in your presence."
"If this happens one more time, we will get up, leave and not come back. NTA." ~Extension_Sun_377
"Clear NTA."
"Pushing someone to talk about something that clearly upsets them doesn't embarrass her."
"But a grown adult having a simple bodily function, mortifies her.."
"Maybe next time she asks, you could start asking her about her farting and pooping habits."
"Shutting the conversation down with the best of callbacks, just in case you can't fart on command in the future!" ~ Specific-Dragonfly29
"NTA. But with such a big audience, you should have said 'Mom, we've been over this dozens of times.'"
'"If someone does not feel comfortable answering a personal question, and you know this is the case, then you are being rude and disrespectful.'"
"'Now, please apologize, and keep your word that you won't do this again.'"
"And do that everytime she attempts to harrass your girlfriend!" ~ AttemptedAdult
"No, that isn't fair to OPs girlfriend."
"OP's mom is an adult."
"She isn't mentally challenged/disabled."
"No IS NO."
"She shouldn't have to have been asked, then told, from OP's recollection 100s of times already."
"Besides which it is extremely rude to ask people about scars or other differences in public."
"Anyone over the age of 5 knows this."
"Don't point, don't stare, don't ask questions."
"OP should travel with bike horn and honk it whenever his mom brings up the scar and/or leave immediately."
"Public shaming is the least she deserves."
"Her behavior is totally uncalled for an unacceptable." ~ Sheanar
"NTA. Your mother repeatedly violated a clearly stated and perfectly reasonable boundary, and now she thinks you're being childish? Nope."
"Her assertion that you should've told her is ridiculous."
"Not only did you repeatedly tell her to stop, your girlfriend told her."
"At that point, what does it matter what you have to say about it?"
"The only relevant opinion in the room was expressed, and your mom kept pushing."
"For real, if she does it again, why stop at a fart?" ~ TurtleTheMoon
"True grace is making everyone feel welcome in your presence."
"OP's mom is gross."
"I can't imagine a situation where I as an adult would look at someone and ask where they got a scar."
"Particularly a scar, in a way, because the likelihood of some trauma behind it is high."
"Might be medical, might be through violence, but it's for sure none of my business to ask."
"It's also worse because, as OP's gf, it is scary to meet parents and their family."
"So his mom is just going all out asserting her dominance by repeatedly pushing for the story." ~ BendingCollegeGrad
"Huge huge NTA."
"You made my day, actually."
"My wife, sitting across the room, gives her enthusiastic endorsement."
"Your dad told you to grow up?"
"Your dad should be congratulated, because he raised you right and you and your girlfriend were the only adults in the room." ~ billlevansatmariposa
"Your mom is being the childish one."
"Like a toddler, asking the same question again and again."
"And not having the emotional intelligence to realize how invasive of a question it is."
"I love how you defused the tension with a fart!"
"And it sounds like it helped your girlfriend too."
"Keep being supportive of her."
"NTA. But your mom certainly is TA." ~ RxTechRachel
"YTA for repeatedly subjecting your girlfriend to your mother."
"And then you didn't want to cause a scene on Mother's Day?"
"What, are you afraid of hurting mommy's feelings while SHE is causing a scene and blatantly disrespecting your girlfriend in front of the whole family??"
"Grow a backbone."
"I feel so bad for your girlfriend."
"Your mom is obviously doing it on purpose."
"I have never asked someone about a SCAR they have."
"And I would never even consider doing so in front of other people, and repeatedly after I've been asked to stop at that!!!"
"She's being disrespectful on purpose!"
"And yet you KEEP allowing her to be in the presence of your girlfriend whom she clearly has an issue with??" ~ RissaRay113
"You must set your boundaries with your mother! Enough!"
"You should not have had to do something that ridiculous to get your mother to shut up!"
"Stand up for your girlfriend."
"You have not stood up to your mother or she would not keep doing it."
"The next time she opens her mouth yell stop!"
"In a loud voice I have told you to stop asking her."
"Then get up and you and her leave."
"You do it everytime until she stops."
"Tell your girlfriend to never answer her."
"Your mom does not take you serious."
"You do this and make her stop." ~ mcmurrml
"NTA. In case you aren't able to repeat your performance next time..."
"Use your phone beforehand to stealthily record your mom promising to not ask about the scar."
"Then replay it at full volume in front of everyone when she does it." ~ SafelySolipsized
"NTA. I actually think it's pretty clever how you deflected away from your mother's obviously out of bounds questioning without starting a full-on fight."
"If your parents give your more crap about it, ask them if they'd prefer a full-on screaming match next time."
"Or if they'll actually respect boundaries like reasonable adults should." ~ Nefariousness-Flashy
Well OP, sounds like Reddit approves our your choice of distraction.
Hopefully mom and dad will come around.
Let's not get long... winded.
Glad you and the GF are smiling.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp