When it comes to relationships, money and finances can be at the root of all discontent.
It's one of those conversations to have sooner than later.
Especially if one partner makes more or all of the money.
Redditor Senior-Attorney8542 wanted to discuss their experience and get some feedback. So naturally, they came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
They asked:
"AITA for hiring a cleaning service and paying for it out of my wife's budget?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"My wife is a S[tay]-A[t]-H[ome]-M[om]."
"We have two children. 10/12."
"I pay all the bills, put money aside for the kid's education, emergencies, savings, vacations, retirement, etc."
"Then whatever is left I split 50/50 with my wife."
"Recently she has decided that I do not do enough around the house so she wants me to start doing more chores."
"I asked if we were going to split up all the chores again."
"What I mean is the kids have their chores, she has hers, and I have mine."
"So if she wants me to do more I want mine redistributed as well."
"I think she can mow the lawn and do the yardwork and house maintenance."
"This is not what she wants."
"She wants me to take on more of the chores we agreed would be hers."
"On top of earning all the money, and all the chores I currently have."
"I asked her what she wanted me to do."
"She gave me a list."
"I hired a cleaning service and paid for it out of our budget before splitting the fun money."
"Now she says that I'm an a**hole and being financially abusive."
"I think it's a fair compromise."
The OP was left to wonder:
"AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared that OP and everyone involved WAS the A**hole.
"I think it's a fair compromise."
"A 'compromise' is an agreement made between both sides."
"From the description, it sounds like you did this unilaterally and are now dealing with the fallout."
"ESH, because even if her request was unreasonable, relationships don't survive unilateral decision-making and failures to communicate." ~ nosecohn
"This is the most reasonable answer and a viewpoint that is often sorely lacking when discussing marital issues online."
"I can be technically right in my marriage till the cows come home, but I won't have a good marriage."
"I won't be happy, my wife won't be happy."
"I doubt very much we would have made it for as long as we have."
"Even if the OP is technically right (and as was pointed out above, I would dispute that because he made a unilateral decision), this seems like it's leading straight for marriage counseling, at best." ~ Lulu_42
"Except it seems she wants him to do more so she can do less."
"OP works, does the yard work, mowing, and house maintenance she is a SAHM to 2 pre-teens."
"OP, his wife, and kids do all of the chores they do and she's reneging on the agreement they already have in place."
"She had a list of her chores that she wanted him to do but he didn't get to give her a list of his chores that he'd like her to do."
"There was no room for negotiation, it was strictly what she wanted."
"I don't think him hiring someone to do those chores without discussing it was the right thing to do either because again there was no negotiating."
"Either this couple doesn't know how to communicate or they are both digging their heels in and of course, there is the likelihood that his only chores are yard care and home maintenance which may be relatively minimal and she does everything else and doesn't get time off to just relax as he does."
"I often wish I could hear both sides of the issue instead of just one side." ~ GrammaBear707
"'Working hard all day parenting' the kids are 10 and 12."
"Not 1 and 3."
"I realize they are on summer break now but during the year they are in school all day."
"Even with being on summer break, they aren't babies."
"They don't need 24/7 monitoring and assistance."
"OP has chores and the kids also have their own chores so it's not like she is constantly cleaning up after them."
"Mom is a STAHM but is only doing a fraction of the housework."
"OP is working full time AND doing some housework."
"Something's not adding up." ~ mmwhatchasaiyan
"He could have told her about his proposed solution in advance and dealt with any resulting pushback before hiring the service."
"That way, he and his wife could have either arrived at a real 'compromise,' or at the very least, she would have known how he intended to handle an issue related to the home they share."
"Again, I'm not saying her request was reasonable."
"The way OP describes the situation, it sounds like his wife really doesn't want to carry her share of the weight in this household."
"However, taking unilateral actions that directly affect the home and finances of one's partner is not the path to a healthy relationship." ~ nosecohn
"No. I think OP was perfectly right."
"Remember, by having to pay an outside service not only was her fun money amount reduced but so was his."
"She sounds spoiled and a lazy a**."
"Her kids are school age so she has plenty of time to get her chores done."
"I am a single mother with no kids at home I do all the Indoor chores along with house maintenance lawn and garden plus work full time." ~ Truth_be_best
"But the compromise and the decision were already made. she unilaterally decided that he should do more."
"At this stage in the children's lives she's not really a stay-at-home mom she's a stay-at-home wife who feels like she shouldn't be doing the stay-at-home wife jobs."
"Yet he should do stay-at-home wife jobs plus bring in all the income."
"That's also not how things work." ~ Spiritual-Print-4879
"At that age, they are plenty able to clean up after themselves and help with chores."
"Different era, but at 10 I was home alone most of the time."
"My parents divorced then and my mom worked two jobs to get by."
"I ended up with all the household chores and yard work."
"Though that doesn't explain why a stay-at-home mom is able to keep up with them and OP doesn't mention anything from her point of view." ~ kornbread435
"Honestly, there is a lot of downtime."
"I stay home while my kid is at school."
"This arrangement was made when she was a baby and my husband was traveling a lot for work."
"It worked so well for us that we just kept it going after she started school."
"I do the cleaning, cooking, shopping, running errands, pet care, driving her to activities, helping with homework after school."
"Basically all of the stuff for the home and family so everyone can relax on evenings and weekends."
"I'm sure it sounds like nothing compared to someone with a paid full-time job, and people who do have full-time jobs also do this stuff, but we're very happy with our arrangement." ~ mrsc1880
"NTA. Part of her 'job' (for lack of a better way to describe it) is to take care of the majority of the housework the majority of the time."
"And I say this as a woman." ~ dgduhon
"Oh, that's direct!"
"Very clever and to the point with hiring a cleaning service on top to really push the message home!"
"I would never have done it though."
"I have never found it useful to deal with one problem in a manner that created a mud splash effect to other critical family matters."
"And the family budget is a huge, impactful, critical area of life and marriage."
"I am not at all surprised she objected."
"You just shot a cannonball directly over the bow."
"You went chores ——> budget."
"You also basically rubbed her nose in the fact you had the unilateral power to do so as well! Power move!"
"I guess it's war then?"
"ESH and so very foolish."
"Conflict management skills for the win."
"Don't carpet bomb across critical areas of family and marriage when trying to resolve stuff with your life partner." ~ Something-bothersome
"I had no intention of framing it that way."
My point was he dealt with his problem by infecting another area of his life."
"He would have been much wiser dealing with the 'chores' issue within a containment field of 'chores' unless they mutually decided to introduce the budget as part of the discussion or a solution."
"Now he is facing a disagreement on two fronts."
"It was a big move to deal with a relatively small, common marriage topic."
"The chores issue is as old as the hills."
"He went big, and now it is bigger."
"Now he has chores and 'financial abuse' as a discussion point to work through."
"While chores is historically an old argument and it sounds like he was on quite stable ground with his working hours and her current responsibilities, financial management can get really tricky."
"Particularly if you pull stunts like he did."
"It was a clear shot over the bow."
"I really think it was foolish." ~ Something-bothersome
"So we have a bunch of chores that need to be done."
"She doesn't want to do them."
"He doesn't want to do them either."
"So he hires a cleaner to do the job and pays for it with 50%-50% split from his and hers fun money."
"They both get the free time; chores are done in exchange for a bit less fun money for both."
"She may not like it, and yes, he could have let her know in advance, but I don't see anything unfair in it."
"Chores are a responsibility for them both, and if they outsource help rather than doing it themselves, they might as well pay for it equally."
"If she wants more fun money, she might as well find herself a job." ~ Interesting_Pin_3490
"ESH. If it were a real compromise, you would be the logical and reasonable thing to do, but the fact you decided without discussing it with your wife makes you TA." ~ ma77mc
Well, OP, Reddit has plenty to say about this situation.
You and your wife may need a serious sit down to hash this out.
If you're not careful, this could all get a lot worse real fast.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp