Support is important for people dealing with postpartum depression or anxiety (PPD/PPA). But as with all things, there should be limits and boundaries.
Especially if the person refuses to seek or accept treatment.
A woman dealing with her sister's PPD turned to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit for feedback.
Asleep-Mycologist560 asked:
"AITA for refusing to let my sister take my kids anymore?"
The original poster (OP) explained:
"My sister (21) has 2 children, aged 3 years and 3.5 months, and suffers from postpartum depression/postpartum anxiety (PPD/PPA). I (30, female) have a 13-year-old son and a 11-year-old daughter."
"School vacation just went by and my sister had asked if both of my children could go visit her for the week. I asked the kids and they said they wanted to, so I said yes."
"Every single time my daughter FaceTimed me, she had my sister's 3-year-old daughter. I didn't think too much of it at the time because my daughter loves this little girl very much."
"But by day 5, both my kids were asking me to come get them. I show up and my sister starts begging me not to take the kids until Sunday—our original agreement—because 'having them here makes my anxiety go away'."
"I simply told her the kids wanted to come home and we left."
"Around dinnertime, my daughter made a comment about how she had the 3-year-old the entire time she was there. To a point where I guess my sister even asked to have the 3-year-old sleep with my daughter so she could get up with her in the morning so my sister could sleep in."
"My daughter stated that the only time my sister came downstairs was to shower or make food for herself. The rest of the time, my kids were left to fend for themselves and take care of the 3-year-old—including meals."
"My sister's boyfriend lives there full time and doesn't work either, so he never leaves. Therefore there were TWO adults in the house and neither of them watched their kid the entire time my kids were there."
"My sister, her boyfriend and the kids actually live with my mother."
"But my mother is on vacation currently and isn't coming back until next Thursday. Typically my mother is home 24/7, so I know my niece is usually cared for."
"I guess there were also multiple times that my sister asked my daughter to clean the house. I didn't confront my sister originally, because I didn't feel there was any point to it."
"But she just called my daughter about an hour ago and my daughter says to me—while still on the phone—'Auntie wants to know if I can go back over there on Friday'. I said 'absolutely not' and went back to doing dishes."
"Then my daughter hands me the phone; it's my sister asking why my daughter can't go there Friday."
"So I say 'because my daughter is not your maid or nanny. You made her wake up with your kid, take care of her all day, clean your house and then put her to sleep at night. My daughter is 11. She will not be parentified'."
"My sister immediately starts crying and says 'it wasn't like that, she was just helping me'."
"So I told her that both my kids wouldn't lie or tell me the exact same story if it didn't happen and that PPA/PPD is not an excuse to pawn 100% of your responsibilities off on a child, especially when her boyfriend was there full time."
"Now she's basically saying it didn't happen like that and that my kids were just 'helping' her and that she enjoyed having them there because the noise helped her not to panic. I told her it still wasn't happening and she called me heartless and said this is the reason women with PPD don't ask for help."
"She's afraid of medications and she's worried if she goes in for therapy or anything that the state will take her kids. Her and I were in foster care for years and unfortunately she still holds the trauma."
"If she was paying my kids it MIGHT be one thing. I was a paid babysitter at my son's age. But I mean, they didn't even offer to make them food, let alone pay them."
"AITA?"
The OP summed up their situation.
"I feel like an a**hole because I know how hard it is to have PPD, but there is zero excuse for this."
Redditors weighed in by declaring:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors decided the OP was not the a**hole (NTA).
"'…she called me heartless and said this is the reason women with PPD don't ask for help'."
"Except that she didn't ask for help. She asked for your kids to go visit her, then put them in charge of childcare."
"Good for you for picking up your kids when they called and then advocating for them when you heard what happened. NTA." ~ glimmerseeker
"Not taking care of her mental health and instead using an 11-year-old for childcare that she can't do herself is far more likely to get CPS involved than going and getting help."
"NTA, and good on you looking out for your children/keeping them from being parentified." ~ caityjay25
"Her comment 'this is why women with PPD don't ask for help' doesn't make sense in this context. She is getting help with childcare, but she is not getting help with PPD/PPA."
"Your 11-year-old daughter is NOT adequate 'support' for PPA/PPD. Professionals specialize in this stuff."
"Sounds like the only 'help' she wants is someone releasing her from responsibility, not actual help for her issues. NTA." ~ somewhenimpossible
"NTA. My compliments on that nice shiny steel spine you've got there."
"This is an example of both parenting done wrong—your sister shoving her responsibilities onto your children—and parenting done right—you stopping the parentification in its tracks."
"If your sister won't get the therapy she needs, then she's going to perpetuate the generational trauma."
"I'd limit her access to your children without you or your mother present, until she addresses her mental health issues. It's just not safe for your kids." ~ savinathewhite
"NTA. Good for you for picking your kids up once they communicated they were over this. And good for you for not allowing them to be used in this manner again."
"They already wasted their entire school break on providing free labor to your sister, it's ridiculous she's asking for more."
"I hate to ask, but are your sure this is PPD and not a substance abuse issue? Are you sure the 3-year-old is being fed and cared for with these two parents who are completely checked out?"
"For her sake, I think it's worth further investigation and, potentially, a call to CPS." ~ JeepersCreepers74
"Lying about the pretense of having two preteens over is not asking for help. Actually asking for help is."
"If she wants an explanation outside of 'my kids are not your nanny/maids', lying to you is also a big breach of trust."
"I understand from your other comments she has trauma and refuses to get actual help...and I am honestly deeply concerned, but that is above my pay grade as a commenting rando online."
"You are NTA and I applaud you advocating for your kids." ~ Silent_Ad_8672
"NTA. Your children are NOT her emotional support animals. She needs to speak with a medical professional about her anxiety instead of using your children." ~ Swimming-Fix-2637
"NTA. Your children called you and asked to come home. You didn't just randomly show up and drag them kicking and screaming and force them to go home.
"So, she wanted you to force your children to stay there with her against their will?"
"Then when you said 'no', she called your 11-year-old directly to pressure her to go back. That's wildly inappropriate."
"She needs clear boundaries enforce when it comes to your kids." ~ LakotaGrl
"NTA—it did happen like that and she knows it."
"She might have ppd/ppa, but she also has a live-in sperm donor. If he's such a sh*t parent, then she shouldn't have had another baby with him." ~ Secret_Double_9239
"NTA. You are right not to send your kids back there. It's not fair for your sister to put that amount of expectation on them."
"I'm worried about your sister. She would do well to get some help for her mental health." ~ Socratic_Labrador_02
"Women with PPD are responsible for managing their mental illness. Not an underage niece or nephew or anyone else they ask/entrap."
"Also, the boyfriend is just consuming air and space in this world. NTA." ~ Radiant-Chipmunk-987
"NTA. I legitimately do not understand how a woman can expect a female child to operate like an adult—cook, clean, look after a younger child—but won't expect a grown a**, unemployed man to do the same." ~ RainGirl11
"NTA. She straight up took advantage of the situation. I understand getting a little RnR, but the first nap she took apparently felt too good to not repeat."
"And your children were there under the impression that they would be having special time with their Aunt and cousin. Just NO."
"I wouldn't put an end to bonding time with Auntie if the kids want it. But I would definitely set up rules and boundaries." ~ Pickme_og72queen
Mental illness isn't a free pass for inappropriate behavior.
Until OP's sister gets help for PPD, OP has not only a right but also a responsibility to limit access to her children.
New Mom Irate After Father-In-Law Ruins Her Birthday With 'Vulgar' Comment About Her Breasts
There's nothing quite like the feeling of going through all the work to prepare a fun celebration, just for someone to undo it with an unkind or gross comment.
That feeling just gets worse when it's your birthday, and that comment was made by someone who's supposed to care about you, sympathized the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor Rude-Pepper-2389 had recently given birth and decided to have a special birthday celebration to reconnect with her loved ones after becoming a mom.
When her father-in-law stopped by unexpectedly and then made comments about her body, the Original Poster (OP) was left so uncomfortable that it ruined the whole celebration for her.
She asked the sub:
The OP wanted to have a special birthday celebration after her baby was born.
"I currently have a five-month-old and haven’t really been taking care of myself or dressing up since having the baby."
"It’s my (25 Female) birthday, and we were having friends over at our house for a private dinner to celebrate."
"My husband (24 Male) and I have been together since we were 18."
"I decided to put on this new silk shirt I got, which, admittedly, was low-cut, but I felt cute in it and felt comfortable around the friends we were having over."
Everything was fine until the OP's father-in-law (FIL) stopped by unexpectedly.
"My husband's dad decided to stop by on his way home from work."
"I will say, he was likely drunk. He works two hours away and proudly told my husband he's down to only four beers on his drive home each day... so, that's healthy."
"When he came in, I was on the couch with my baby propped up beside me, bottle feeding him. Keep in mind, I am not breastfeeding, so no, my breasts are not any larger right now."
"My husband's dad leaned down to look at the baby and then suddenly shouted, 'D**n, son, she could knock you out with those things in bed! Like cracking two coconuts together.'"
"This was fully and undoubtedly in reference to my breasts."
The OP was shocked by the comment and very uncomfortable.
"It made me deeply uncomfortable and embarrassed."
"I was so stunned, I couldn’t even process what he said to me, and our friends just stared at me, blinking."
"He’s a redneck, so he's said some pretty vulgar stuff over the years, but this just seems to take the cake, as it was the first time it was directed at me."
"When he stepped out, I told my husband he needed to speak to him, and that the comment wasn’t okay."
"I went to change clothes and decided to never ever wear that shirt again."
"When I brought it up to my husband, he said he didn't hear the comment at first, but then he laughed when I told him what he said. He's always laughed when he feels awkward and has always had a hard time standing up to his parents in any capacity."
"When he and my father-in-law spoke, my FIL just said, 'I shouldn’t have said that to her, I know how she can be,' which just feels even more like I’m just being dramatic."
"Since then, I think my husband just wants me to drop it and move on, truthfully."
The OP wasn't sure what to do after what happened.
"This genuinely ruined my entire night. Am I just too sensitive, or was this an inappropriate thing to say?"
"There's also been no apology since then. This happened on Thursday, and then my father-in-law came by again on Friday with flowers to wish me a happy Mother's Day before Mother's Day Sunday."
"I think that was his way of trying to just breeze past the awkwardness. He's never gotten me a gift the whole seven years I've known him, so the flowers were odd. But I still feel really uncomfortable."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that her father-in-law's comments were rude and just plain creepy.
"NOR at all. That was really rude of him. Anyone would be offended." - Bookbringer
"NOR. That’s firmly in the category of what should be an 'inside thought,' and we should learn what those are at a much younger age than this guy is."
"F**king h**l, this is an absolutely mental thing to say out loud, let alone to your daughter-in-law." - Electronic-Fennel828
"FIL is an AH. I love that you think his being a redneck excuses it, but d**n. Even rednecks should know better than to speak that way to their son's wife."
"What does your husband have to say? Does he understand how breath-takingly rude his father was, or is he Team 'That's Just How He Is'?"
"I'd go very low contact with the old perv. NOR, he put you in an uncomfortable position with his crude remark. Is he married? I'd tell the MIL. I'd tell the whole family. Yes, it's embarrassing, but he is the one who should be embarrassed. Don't accept his non-apology." - Top-Bit85
"Maybe I’m desensitized after having large breasts since I was 13 (I’m 28 now), but I let out a little snort based on how immature of a joke it was. I’d simply tell FIL, 'Yes, I know, my boobs are big,' and move on."
"That said, I would never make such a comment about another person's body. Just because I'm technically fine with it doesn't mean I assume anyone else is!"
"Not everyone is the same, and if OP felt uncomfortable, she’s NOR. Her body, her boundaries." - Both_Original2094
"I’m sorry. That’s upsetting. My father is like this with his father. Even if it’s very offensive comments, he’s uncomfortable and has problems confronting him. It sounds like your husband isn’t going to have a talk with him, which is hurtful."
"I would explain to your husband how uncomfortable the situation was for you and that it’s a serious matter, especially if it happens again. And if he still tries to brush it off, then I would tell him you no longer want your FIL coming to your home."
"It’s your life, too, and he’s not the one being hurt here, you are." - w_coastultraviolence
Others were specifically angry about the tactics the father-in-law used to try to get out of trouble.
"Seriously? Saying 'I know how she can be' is a classic way to blame the victim for having boundaries. It’s your birthday, not a Hooters convention. What a creep. If he can’t look at the baby without checking out your breast, he shouldn't be invited to the house." - Specific_Parsnip3264
"'I know how she can be' is so f**ked up. He's the one being a disgusting person. You need to shine up your husband's spine to properly call him out at the time next time, because there will be a next time." - dancepantz
"The bit that pisses me off the most is, 'I know how she can be,' which is his way of making it her problem that she doesn't like her FiL sexualising her in front of her friends." - Outside-Partait-8935
"The 'joke' comment is gross, but that follow-up comment is infuriating. NOR, OP. But this guy will be in your life for a while, so firmly & calmly shutting this stuff down is completely appropriate."
"I'd wear the d**n shirt again to the next family function and look him right in the eyes next time!" - RationalFish
"When we let things like this slide for others, it's not long before it ends up on our doorstep, and of course, nobody says anything because keeping the peace is the norm. It doesn't have to be getting into their face and yelling abuse back. Just a comment such as, 'Well, that's super tacky to say,' or asking them why they'd say that." - Kattnapped
"The OP said, 'He's said some pretty vulgar stuff over the years... but this is the first time it was directed to me.'"
"Normalise calling stuff out when they are talking about others, and they won't feel so comfortable saying it to you."
"It's a gross thing for him to say, but I guess him buying you flowers is his way of saying sorry."
"Sounds like you are in the situation of a lot of new mothers, where you suddenly realise this stuff matters because you want better influences for your child, and better support for yourself. NOR." - Jumpy-Jello-
Now, about that shirt...
"Please re-think your decision to never wear the cute shirt again, girl!! It's something that you liked very much because it made you feel good about yourself. Don't let some backwoods id**t ruin that for you."
"Wear that shirt till it's worn out and can't be worn anymore!! You should be able to feel good about yourself in whatever you like to wear."
"Your husband should have immediately checked his father, not waited until he was told to do so after his father left the room. In front of everyone there, your husband should have told his father not to ever speak about you or to you in that kind of manner, and if his father doesn't like it, he knows where the door is."
"Hubby should have called him out for his response as well. You did absolutely nothing wrong. You were not the problem; his dad was. This comes down to your husband needing to protect his wife, and he didn't do that." - Lynzo141982
"If he is a redneck, like you said, he won't outright apologize, but flowers are his way of saying sorry."
"I hope he won't say anything again, or else you can expect a nicely tended garden for at least a year."
"About your top, I hope you can wear it again. It takes a lot to feel cute, being a new mum."
"If not, get some fabric dye, dye the top a different color, and embroider a flower on it. This makes the top new, different, and every time you wear it, you can use the mantra ... I'm cute, I don't care what anyone says."
"You've got this!!" - No_Kangaroo_6637
Even if the father-in-law was joking and meant no harm, this is one of those situations where he needs to admit that his joke did not land well, he did cause harm, and he needs to apologize. Just because some people enjoy joking in that manner does not mean that everyone will be comfortable with it, and it's important to respect everyone's boundaries and zones of comfort.