The consequences of our actions aren't always what we thought they'd be.
So what happens when someone else's choices threaten to create consequences for you?
That was the issue facing Redditor and Original Poster (OP) Apprehensive-Egg4368 when she came to the "Am I the A**hole" (AITA) subReddit for judgment.
She asked:
"AITA for not helping my neighbor with her kids after her husband left her"
First, backstory.
"Background info:"
"My husband and I (late 20s M&F), have lived next to Jack and Jill for two years."
"We have a son who's six years old, and they have two kids who are a similar age, but a little bit older."
"All the kids go to the same elementary school and I used to see Jack in the car rider line."
"Our neighborhood is relatively close to the school so the school bus does not pick up here, we have to walk or drive our kids to school."
"Jack and Jill have constantly had loud fights ever since they moved here."
Thorough backstory.
"And by fights I mostly mean Jill would scream at jack and kick him out the house on a weekly basis."
"Normally he would sleep in his car and come back inside in the morning after she leaves for work."
"Jill works as a CNA at a nearby hospital, the 6am-6pm shift."
"Jack worked from home, like I do, which let him take the kids to school."
"Well, after this last fight jack packed up all his stuff and left, flew back home to his mother in a different country."
A friend in need?
"Jill recently came to me saying that she has no one to watch her kids from roughly 5 am to 7 pm."
"She asked if she could send them over in the morning, have me watch them and feed them breakfast and then take them to school."
"And then later pick them up and feed them dinner and watch them till she gets off work."
"I explained to her that being expected to be a second parent basically to two kids is not something I'm really interested in."
"I asked how much she was willing to pay and she said she EXPECTED me to do it for free, since she has no friends and no one else to ask."
"She also asked if I would watch them on the weekends so she could pick up extra shifts, otherwise she won't be able to pay the rent."
"I told her absolutely not, and that she's insane basically to think I'd agree to something so unreasonable when we aren't even friends and our kids aren't friends either."
"My husband thinks I was an a**hole, and that we could offer to at least help sometimes for the kids sake."
"My stance is that we both know she wouldn't do the same for us if the roles were reversed, since Jill isn't really a nice person."
OP was left to wonder,
"AITA for not helping my neighbor with her kids after her husband left?"
Having explained the situation, OP turned to Reddit for judgment.
Redditors weighed in by declaring:
-
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors decided: NTA
Commenters had no patience for the entitlement.
"NTA -"
"This is quite an extensive and unreasonable expectation. It's not even her asking you for help, it's her expecting you to pick up her slack."
"5a-7a Monday-Friday (with breakfast and transportation)"
"3p-7p Monday-Friday (with snack, dinner, and transportation)"
"weekends as needed"
"And let's not forget, it's about time for summer break. So you'd what, have to provide full daycare while she works?"
"She needs to come up with a plan on her own that does not involve forcing neighbors to parent her children." ~ DisneyBuckeye
"The 5am start is the absolutely bonkers cherry on top of the whole ice cream sundae of entitlement."
"Unless OP and her husband have a 7am start at their own jobs, they're not going to be getting up at 5am at the moment."
"So the neighbour wants to get her own kids up by 4.30am at the latest (to get them and their things together) and get OP or her husband up to receive them at 5am."
"Even if both OP and the kids are able to get back to sleep, it will only be for an hour, or maybe 90 minutes at a push, so hardly time for the properly restful REM sleep."
"Or you keep them up but risk waking up OPs son, also reducing his rest time."
"I might, if I was feeling generous, accept a drop-off that was after the normal time that I get up."
"But there's not a chance in Hell I'd be changing my wake up time to 5am for at least 5 days a week to accommodate someone who feels entitled to free childcare from me." ~ NannyOggsKnickers
For others, it was just too early.
"Exactly what I was thinking."
"5 f*cking am?"
"I would not wake up for my nephews at 5 am let alone some chick that is defo lost her minds to be kicking her husband weekly out of the house."
"OP better stays her grounds cause that is sleep deprivation at best." ~ Dessinigx
"Exactly if nieces and nephews need care cause parents are leaving 5am, than saud nieces and nephews will have to come and sleep over, I am not waking up at ungodly stupid o'clock."
"This is for the siblings I like, not the inlaws I dislike 😒" ~ Massive-Wishbone6161
What about escalation?
"She'd just start saying that the kids should just sleep over 'this one time so they can get more sleep since they're exhausted waking up that early.'"
"It would turn into mom never being there/going out to party and leaving her kids permanently with OP, after all, 'sHe'S a SiNgLe mOm NoW and mom's deserve to have fun too."' ~ hjo1210
"We all know that if OPs husband volunteers to have the kids 'occasionally' it will very quickly become the permanent 5 days a week that this woman wants."
"Every day will be some kind of emergency or desperate need, or she'll just dump the kids on the doorstep and drive off before OP can say no."
"And it won't be the husband picking up any of the slack. OP will be voluntold to deal with it all." ~ NannyOggsKnickers
"Sounds like one of those situations where you bring the kids over to your house and never hear from her again."
"In all seriousness, NTA x100."
"If there was some cash I wound consider it (kind of) but free? That's worthy of a literal LOL. Like you guys aren't family, not friends, what are you getting out of this?" ~ LetsRide987
There was also the money issue.
"This woman would actually be basically paying the kids mom to watch them if you factor in the cost of said snacks and food."
"If mom isn't paying neighbour and neighbour has to feed them? Food is expensive man. Going from 1 to 3 kids is no joke." ~ Intelligent-Base3385
"Accounting for the extra food, this will actually cost OP money."
"This woman isn't even only asking for free transportation and labor, but wants OP to pay for their basic needs out of her own pocket."
"That's insane." ~ AndShesNotEvenPretty
"Not to mention how expensive it would be to add 2 more children (around 16 extra servings/ week according to the schedule suggested by Jill) to the meal plan with the rising food costs."
"And to not even be willing to cover THAT in and of itself is extremely rude." ~ Beneficial-Step4403
Think of the children.
"NTA How sad for the kids that their dad just left the country and isn't taking responsibility for his kids either, which makes him sound like not such a great person as well."
"Even if she isn't the nicest person, being the sole person responsible for 2 kids is so tough and I honestly do feel bad for her and the kids."
"However, expecting anyone, much less people who aren't family, to be responsible for helping her get through it is so unreasonable. And expecting it for free??"
"It is a terribly sad situation but that doesn't mean that you have to take on that responsibility. Exactly how long does she think you should have to do this?"
"30+ hours a week when they are in school and all day when school is out for the next 4-5 years?"
"It is too much to ask. Honestly, it's too much to ask even with compensation when you have a whole other job to do and a family of your own."
"I do feel bad for her but you can't personally take that on, especially when she doesn't seem like a reasonable person."
"You will never get out of it."
"I'm assuming you are in the US because she has a CNA job, in which case there are programs to help low income families with child care."
"If she can't afford where she lives then she needs to look at what her options are. It's a terrible situation for her kids mostly but I don't think you are the AH here." ~ wontgotoheaven
The impact of our choices doesn't always just effect us, but can ripple outward.
And sometimes, those ripples hit a wall.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp