You can't take it with you. At least as far as we know.
Any wealth or possessions will remain after you're gone. But does that make a person obligated to leave the fruits of their earthly labors to their descendants?
Or do offspring need to be judged worthy? And who does the judging?
A father examining these questions had a frank discussion with his children.
It didn't go well.
So he turned to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit for feedback.
The Redditor asked:
"AITA for telling my children that if they don't grow up and get real jobs, they aren't getting a penny from me when I die, and then giving them a reality check?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I'm not dying. My kids thought they'd get my savings when I die. I told them no, then lectured them."
"I (57M) have two kids, N (30 Male) and A (27 Female). N works part-time flipping burgers, but insists his real job is as a gaming streamer. A claims she's a 'professional' influencer, her livelihood supported by her boyfriend."
"My kids are adults, what they do with their lives is their choice. We've had several arguments about it, but ultimately, as adults, the responsibility for their lives is their own."
"Over Christmas, we were talking about their mother (on Zoom) when A brought up the subject of her will, wondering if she'd left anything to them."
"I confessed that she passed before ever writing one, and the money she did have was used up the year she passed."
"We were a dual-income family in a time when neither of us were making a lot. It was a hard time."
"Eventually, I joined a friend in the private sector and my fortune changed. I'm not 'rich', but I'll never be uncomfortable again."
"Well, N then decided to 'lighten the mood' by implying that I'll make up for it when I pass. I asked him what he meant, and the conversation went as follows:"
"Me: What do you mean?"
"N: Well, you have a lot of money, right? It'll go to us."
"Me: And who told you that?"
"A: What do you mean?"
"Me: I've made it very clear that I don't approve of the way you both live. You both chose not to get an education or real jobs."
"You have no way of supporting yourself. (I often buy them groceries)."
"You refuse to help yourselves, so why would I enable your 'lifestyles' by leaving you my savings when I die? You want my money, then grow up and get real jobs, but the bank of dad will be forever closed when dad is forever closed."
"What followed was a heated argument where both N and A accused me of being manipulative and unsupportive, so I got real with them."
"Me: You both refuse to grow up. Flipping burgers is an honourable job, but it's not going to keep a roof over your head."
"What if you have kids? What if you get fired?"
"And (A), what will you do if your boyfriend breaks up with you because all you do is sit on your a** all day and take photos of yourself? You want to do that, find a modeling agency."
"A real job. You both speak of chasing your dreams, but neither one of you are in any position to do that because neither of you wants to take responsibility for yourselves right now."
"I've said it a million times. You're adults."
"What you do with your lives is your choice and your responsibility. Dreams take money, and neither of you have that."
"Grow up. Get a job. A real job. Then chase your dreams."
"I'm not going to leave a penny to either of you if your life plan is to 'get by' until I die, then coast through the rest of your lives off the earnings of my hard work."
"N ended the call after a prolonged silence. A called me an a**hole then did the same. I haven't heard from either since, and neither will take my calls."
"So, AITA here? I think I might be because I was unnecessarily harsh on Christmas."
The OP added:
"Some of the feedback coming at me is because I'm critical of their 'jobs'. To be clear, a job is something that you make money from."
"Neither earn any money as a streamer or 'influencer'. And I defend my opinion of flipping burgers."
"It's an honourable job, but not a career if you're doing it part-time like my son, thus making him ineligible for promotion. If he were working it full time, I would be worried, but I'd know he's taking responsibility for his life."
"This conversation has come up a lot during the pandemic."
"My son was laid off, and my daughter isn't working, but both have been speaking a lot about their jobs as a streamer and influencer while bringing in no money to show for it."
"We've argued about it a lot and it just came to a head when they brought up my will."
Redditors weighed in on the situation by declaring:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors decided the OP was not the a**hole.
"You are only 57. Jesus. You could potentially live for 30 to 40 more years."
"What was their plan? To live in poverty until their 60's or 70's?"
"And what if you need expensive medical care later on or care services in your old age that wipes out your retirement money?"
"Not only are they entitled as hell, but they have no idea how the world works or how to realistically plan for the future. NTA." ~ MiddlingMe
"My partner's brother is in his late 30's and has been floating through life, refusing to hold down work and endlessly being enrolled in university without earning degrees. His plan, for years, has been to live off of his inheritance."
"He's only just realised in the last year or so that their parents are pretty healthy and will probably live for at least another 10 years, more likely 20+ and he's starting to freak out."
"There's a good possibility OP's kids never thought about how long it might be until the payday, they just imagined the payday." ~ PurrPrinThom
"NTA. It's troubling that their current savings plan is your demise." ~ gay_flatulent
"NTA. And I like you. Because you didn't say something like 'flipping burgers isn't a real job' but you did point out the reality that flipping burgers doesn't get the bills paid, especially for a family and especially part time."
"You also pointed out to your daughter that if she wants to make a job as an influencer, then work towards a more realistic job as a model."
"You're not knocking what they like in life, you're showing them that how they are going about it isn't sustainable and that relying on your death isn't going to solve their money problems late."
"Also, that's morbid and terrible."
"Reality is harsh. You gave them a hard check."
"Doesn't matter that it was on Christmas. If anything, your kids are the a**holes for assuming your money is theirs and asking if their mother left them money (on Christmas?)." ~ cass_92SS
The OP responded:
"I worked as a dishwasher for nearly ten years. It paid my way through college."
"I have a lot of respect for line cooks and servers. But it's because I did that that I also saw a lot of them living paycheck to paycheck."
"Full time, it's doable. Not encouraged, but doable."
"But at part-time, you're heading nowhere fast and it's only a matter of time before you hit a dead end. I don't want that for my son, but he won't make the change."
"He says his place doesn't have an opening for full time and he refuses to look elsewhere."
"The truth, as it's obvious to me anyway, is he enjoys the status quo and sees no issue with it because his foreseeable future as he sees it is that he'll make it big as a streamer and won't ever have to worry about money."
In the end, you may not be able to take it with you, but Redditors decided you can decide where it goes.
And you really don't need to justify or explain your decision to anyone.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp