Family is not necessarily defined by blood relations.
Certain people who don't share our DNA are every bit as much, or more, a part of our family than our blood-related aunts, uncles, and cousins.
Sometimes, a member of our nuclear family does or says something that results in their becoming estranged, as we try harder and harder to forget the fact that they are related to us.
No matter how many times they might try to remind us that they're our family.
Redditor Witty-Butterfly4195 had a tense relationship with her father after the death of her mother, resulting in their eventually losing contact.
However, upon learning that the original poster (OP) was about to hit a significant milestone in her life, the OP's father reached out to her through her grandmother about reconnecting.
Something the OP flatly refused to do.
Wondering if she was in the wrong for doing so, the OP took to the subReddit "Am I The A**hole" (AITA), where she asked fellow Redditors:
"AITA for digging in my heels and refusing to invite my estranged father and his wife to my wedding?"
The OP explained why her father was, and always will be persona non grata at her wedding:
"I'm (30 F[emale]) getting married this year, and the wedding is going to be smaller, so those we want to invite know when the wedding will take place and are confirmed to be free."
"Invites will go out in the summer."
"But unofficially the people who will be invited have been invited."
"This was because it was important to us to have those closest to us present and we didn't want a hugely expensive wedding."
"This has become a problem because I did invite my grandmother (paternal) and she has a relationship with my estranged father while I do not."
"Background is needed here."
"When my brother and I were 4, we lost our mom."
"Our mom's twin sister helped our dad out a lot after mom died."
"We actually lived with her for 7 or 8 months while our dad was spiraling and losing control of himself."
"She was there for our first day of school. She fed us, clothed us, and protected us a lot during the period we lived with her. Once Dad pulled himself together and took us back, she was still the person taking care of us after school and on Saturdays or Sundays when our dad would work."
"She was essential to us."
"She and mom were orphans, so it was just her for the maternal side and dad's side were not close by and did not play much of a role in those earlier childhood memories."
"But our aunt did."
"Then my dad got engaged, and life changed fast."
"My dad's wife did not want our aunt around anymore."
"She wanted to become the mom and she did not feel like my aunt would make that easy on her."
"So my dad and his wife (fiancée at the time) moved us out of state, and we moved around a lot, so my aunt could not get any visitation rights to us."
"We did not get to see or speak to her at all after that. I know she fought for us."
"She did track us down a couple of times and we moved again."
"We missed her like crazy, and over the decade that followed, Dad tried to erase all traces of our aunt and mom and attempted to create a little nuclear family with the four of us."
"But we hated him and we hated her. When we were teenagers, we tracked down our aunt, and at 18, we moved out of our dad's house and ended all contact with them."
"My grandmother was aware of all this, and when we were kids, she was understanding and did attempt to advocate for us to see our aunt."
"But once my dad found out I was getting married, through a person who actually isn't invited to the wedding but knew I was engaged, he was talking to my grandmother and he told her how badly he and his wife want to come and how sad they are that they have been removed so completely from our lives."
"Now my grandmother is saying they should be invited, or at least my father because he's still my father."
"I told her it would not happen and refused to compromise with just him."
"So she's unhappy and she said I am taking things too far and doing what they did, only I know how harmful it can be long term."
"AITA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in on where they believed the OP fell in this particular situation by declaring:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
The Reddit community was in agreement that the OP was not the a**hole for refusing to invite her estranged father to her wedding.
Everyone agreed that the OP's father's past behavior more than justified his not being present at her wedding, and the OP's grandmother needed to mind her own business. Many even suggested the OP disinvite her grandmother as well.
"NTA."
"This man let you down, big time."
"H refused to let you have a relationship with your Aunt."
"Constantly moving you to avoid your Aunt was cruel."
"He has no right to be a part of your life or your wedding."- Successful_Bath1200
"NTA."
"Sorry, but Grandma doesn't get a say."
"She didn't experience having an important, consistent, loving person ripped from her life as a child just because her dad and his new wife were jealous."
"She doesn't know how it feels to have a family forced on you and your only family tie to your deceased mom taken away."
"Nope."
"Her little bit of unhappiness that your father is not invited to the wedding is NOTHING compared to the unhappiness he caused."
"And oh, your father is sad he and his wife are not invited?"
"Too bad."
"They made that happen for themselves."- Stranger0nReddit
"NTA."
"Your grandmother is unhinged to suggest that years of isolating two grieving children from the only mother figure they know is somehow equivalent to not inviting an estranged father to a wedding."
"Has she always placed some of the responsibility of your father's abusive behavior onto you?"
"Or is this recent a**holery from grandma?"- Disruptorpistol
"NTA."
"It's your wedding; it's your invitation list."
"Reassure your NAN that you know and are comfortable with both the short-term and the long-term consequences of what you have decided to do."
"Also, tell her that if your father shows up, you will have him removed from the site."
"The last thing that you want is a surprise at what should be a joyous event for you."-Individual_Ad_9213
"Well, grandma can be 'unhappy'."
"But who is on your guest list just isn't her decision."
"Your grandmother was good to you during your childhood, and you still feel warm toward her, so she gets an invitation."
"You don't feel the same way about your dad and his wife."
"NTA."- YouthNAsia63
"'As you tried to remove our aunt, one of the only people who listened to us, and then tried to have us accept your decision, you effectively cut your contributions out of our lives'."
"'You chose to remove our family'."
"'I've chosen to remove you all together, and you know why'."
"'Please don't contact me again'."
"Send that to your father, and have security at your wedding."
"Find a big burly teddy bear bouncer, ask them if they can help, and that should be it."
"NTA."- RemoteBroccoli
"NTA."
"That man and his wife basically stole your childhood away from your aunt, who was the next best thing to your mother."
"That man and his wife can go and have their pity party elsewhere."- molewarp
"NTA."
"However your dad is a massive AH who cared more about his new wife than his grieving children and you're are simply making him lay on the bed he made."- jajbliss
"NTA."
"Now that you know your grandmother's stance, I would consider hiring security for your wedding just in case your sperm donor and his family 'show up out of nowhere'."
"And, warn your grandmother that her relationship with you is on the line."
"Your sperm donor has a lot of nerve wanting the 'perfect family' while he went the distance to destroy his."
"Congratulations on your upcoming wedding!"- aquavenatus
"NTA."
"They uprooted your life repeatedly just so that your stepmother could have her way and so your aunt couldn't get visitation?"
"Nope, they are in the NC penalty box for the rest of their lives."
"You may need to cut your paternal grandmother out of the wedding as well because I would bet real money your father tries to show up anyway if he's told where it is being held."- C_Majuscula
Every father dreams of the day they walk their little girl down the aisle.
But that privilege needs to be earned by being a present and loving father in their daughter's life.
Something the OP's father most definitely was not, prioritizing his second wife over the needs of his children.
Maybe sitting at home on the night of the OP's wedding will finally give the OP's father the slightest idea of how neglected the OP felt throughout most of her childhood.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp