Parents want to give their kids anything they need when possible.
But sometimes when it comes to money, some things gotta give.
Who gets what, how much and why?
Case in point...
A deleted Redditor wanted to discuss his experience and get some feedback. So naturally, he came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
He asked:
"AITA for not wanting to give my younger daughter's future wedding fund to my older daughter's house deposit?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"Me (M[ale] 59) and my wife (F[emale] 53) have two daughters let's call them Rose (F 27) and Lily (F 24) who both earn roughly the same amount of money (quite a lot for their ages)."
"Rose has a two-year-old and a husband who earns a fair bit less than her and Lily has a boyfriend who earns a bit more than her."
"They both inherited a big chunk of money from my mother, enough for a 10%-15% deposit on a house they could realistically buy."
"Rose has always lived beyond her means and certainly her husband's."
"They've alluded to using some of their house savings when their daughter (Poppy) was born despite my wife looking after Poppy full time whilst my daughter worked."
"Her husband has recently confessed he hasn't saved a penny in the almost ten years they've been together."
"On the other hand, Lily and her boyfriend have almost doubled the original amount saved and never seem to have any issues with money whilst we constantly seem to be helping out Rose."
"Both girls are looking at buying houses."
"Lily and her boyfriend have been approved for a lovely house with a 25% deposit."
"Rose also had an offer accepted but as it turned out due to commuting costs and childcare from moving away adding up to almost the cost of another mortgage they will only be able to get a mortgage for roughly half they thought and only have 5%."
"Rose told Lily this and asked how on Earth she had been accepted on a bigger house as a younger couple."
"Lily was honest and told her how much she made as a couple and how much they were putting down and Rose broke down a little."
"She asked how much we had given Lily and we told her nothing extra."
"That night my wife and I were talking and she said she didn't realize how badly Rose was financially and how well Lily was doing."
"We'd paid for Rose's wedding and planned to do so for Lily too but so far she's insisted she doesn't want/need it."
"I want to keep the money so we can still offer it when the time comes even if Lily still won't accept."
"But my wife wants to give the money to Rose as she's saying having a child makes it a lot harder for Rose and she doesn't want the money to go to waste when her only grandchild doesn't have a home."
The OP was left to wonder:
"So AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP was NOT the A**hole.
"NTA. Taking the money earmarked for Lily's wedding and giving it to Rose is literally 'throwing the good money after the bad.'"
"The difference between the two sisters is not how much they earned but how well they manage what they have."
"Lily and her partner are financially savvy and responsible, and Rose and her husband are not."
"No matter how much money you give Rose, it will go to waste."
"Having a child your wife's been watching for free = no childcare expenses, so 'Ahh, having a child is harder' is just an excuse your wife has made up to guilt you."
"The child is also not homeless; they have a roof over their heads."
"You would not be the first set of parents who enable the less competent child at the expense of the more competent one, and this inequality and favoritism rarely if ever do any favors to the parent's relationship with the more capable (but less favored) child or the relationship between the siblings."
"Favoring the child who has a child of their own over the child who doesn't (at least not yet), same."
"What's fair is fair."
"Unfair doesn't become okay just because Rose spends all the money she gets her hands on." ~ Content-Plenty-268
"The overriding principle must be fairness."
"If Rose gets additional money, then this should be made up for Lily somehow."
"That could be done through inheritance, for instance."
"But it all needs to be transparent to everyone. No surprises."
"But Rose need not get any additional."
"This isn't a case of anyone being homeless, just how comfortable is Rose's lifestyle." ~ Boeing367-80
"This is just enabling Rose to just continue to live beyond her means and almost encouraging it since she will think that Mommy and Daddy will continuously bail her out. NTA." ~ RogeeSmith12
"So true, I won't call out names but there is a very wealthy celebrity widow in the news who is constantly having to bail out her daughter's poor financial decisions."
"The girl was given a modest inheritance and blew right through it."
"The public is more sympathetic towards the daughter because the mother has an enormous fortune."
"I feel like if the daughter had access to a huge sum such as $400 million she would blow right through that too."
"Some people are just financially irresponsible." ~ Chateaudelait
"My suggestion would be to give the money to Lilly now."
"If she truly doesn't want the money and thinks it would serve Rose better, let Lilly be the one who gives the gift."
"Parents have then been perfectly fair."
"Lilly can't be mad if her circumstances change because she was the one who has the money away (if she chooses to) and if she chooses not to, Rose hasn't been favored or slighted."
"Take some delicate wording to make sure that Lilly doesn't feel obligated to give the money, but I imagine she's aware of Roses's situation." ~ funklab
"I wouldn't give any money to people who are so irresponsible about saving up."
"My friend was with her ex for 10 years."
"They had 2 kids and while she saved for a down payment working 3 part-time jobs, he saved exactly zero even though he had a higher paying full-time one."
"That plus many other things caused the breakdown of their relationship." ~ ravynwave
"NTA: But you even if Lily turns down the money you aren't doing Rose any favors."
"This is the case of someone losing their job and struggling, or someone getting in debt after an injury or illness."
"This is someone who lived outside of the means and never saved a dime in a decade."
"I wouldn't be surprised if you continue having to bail her out if she doesn't learn how to be a fiscally responsible adult." ~ thea**holethrowawa
"My mom is exactly like this."
"Lived outside of her means, never saved a dime."
"She's now 76 and I, her only child, am stuck footing the bill for her life. $2k/mo!!!"
"OP, if you want to do Rose a favor, don't bail her out this time or in the future."
"If someone in my mom's life had forced her to figure things out and save, we might not be in this situation now."
"It will only get worse." ~ Crlady
"Absolutely this."
"It seems like both girls/partners earn enough that they're above the poverty line."
"Assuming both couples are middle-class earners, both have had similar opportunities to save."
"I work with finances for a living and I always tell clients you can afford what you WANT to afford."
"Some people want a new car every couple of years, their kids wear designer clothes, wife likes designer bags."
"Another family of similar demographics may prefer to spend their money on traveling while driving older cars and dressing more inexpensively."
"A third family may care most about saving for retirement and forego a lot of luxuries in their middle age years."
"None of them are necessarily right or wrong (although I have personal opinions on each) but none are the same. That's fine!"
"But the couple who had new cars and luxury items can't then be jealous of the couple who lives the high life during retirement."
"Financial choices always have consequences and it looks like Rose is gonna be learning that the hard way." ~ Commercial-Place6793
"Your wife is the AH."
"She is actively enabling your oldest in her bad decisions."
"The child does not suffer from homelessness."
"She is almost 30."
"It's time to put some boundaries down."
"Stop helping her living over her means."
"Teach her the reality of life."
"Your eldest is clearly the golden child of your wife. You go, Sir."
"Keep things equal."
"If your youngest doesn't want the money put it in a trust fund FOR HER FUTURE (children or not)."
"If the eldest can't budget it's not the youngest duty to sacrifice non-stop for her." ~ Unwanted88
"NTA. Your grandchild isn't living on the streets."
"She has a home, just not the house Rose wants."
"Your wife hasn't figured out that Rose will go through that money like water and have her hand out for more before the ink is dry on the mortgage."
"Nothing is making things harder on Rose except Rose and her husband." ~ FuzzyMom2005
"Agreed, unfortunately, there's a fine and blurry line between helping someone and enabling them."
"Rose does not want to change, continually bailing her out ensures she never needs to change. NTA OP." ~ Amazing_Cabinet1404
Well, OP, Reddit is with you.
In the end, it's your money, well yours and your wife's of course.
So a serious discussion is necessary.
Rose may need a financial advisor.
You can only do so much.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp