In a since deleted Reddit account, a recently married groom details something they just learned about their wedding day.
The Original Poster (OP) knows his mom and new wife got off to a rough start, but he chose to have his wife's back.
However, recently the OP learned his wife played a prank on his mom on their wedding day when she attempted to get her makeup done for the wedding.
When he found out, he called his wife out for being a bully and she, in turn, called him a "mama's boy".
This drove the OP to subReddit "Am I the A**hole?" (AITA).
He asked:
"AITA for expressing discomfort about my wife and her friends pranking my mom on our wedding day?"
He went on to explain:
"My mom hasn't been the greatest in the past. She can be really rude and was catty."
"She didn't get off to a good start with my wife due to her own rude and self centered behavior, but I took my wife's side and laid down boundaries."
"My mom gets that she can't be rude these days. I fully get my wife will never like her, mom probably won't like her either, and we all just avoid each other for the most part."
"Don't get me wrong. It makes me sad as I used to be close to my family, but wife comes first."
"We recently got married and it was a nearly perfect day. The one issue that aroused is my mom had a fairly large very noticeable food coloring stain on her cheek (about the size of a lighter)."
"Obviously she wasn't happy about this and wanted it covered. She never does her own makeup and knows very little about makeup."
"The makeup artist was a friend of my wife's, and knew all the drama about my mom. She told her she would try but the makeup would have to be darker to hide it."
"She and my wife giggled ahead of time and decided to f*ck with her. She made it super dark, like orange. My mom has fair skin so it looked ridiculous."
"My mom seemed to believe her that nothing lighter would cover it and just removed all the makeup and went on with her big pink blotch."
"I didn't know about this at the time, but we recently got back from our honeymoon and my wife hosted a dinner to look at wedding pictures."
"Her friends all began laughing about what they did to my mom. This was the first time I heard about it and I said that was kind of mean girlish."
"My wife gave me a look. Her friends kept saying it was funny and my mom is dumb and got what she deserved."
"At this point I got annoyed and said they acted like middle school bullies and they should be embarrassed."
"Whatever my mom had done in the past, she was not the problem on the wedding day. This might be way too far, but I said at least she laughed it off and moved on with her spot."
"They would have spent the whole day insecure and worried about Instagram."
"When they left my wife became very upset and said I should be on her side 100% not 95% and that I humiliated her by speaking to her friends like that. She accused me of being a mama's boy."
Redditors weighed in by declaring:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors decided:
"NTA. You were correct - your wife was acting like a middle school bully, not an adult."
"And being her husband does not mean you support her blindly, it means you have the courage to tell her when she is going down a bad path."
"This is not being a mama's boy, this is being a good and moral human being. If she wants you to be behind her 100%, then she needs to act like a grown-up." - bamf1701
"NTA"
"What your wife did was cruel and came from an ugly place."
"It was beyond unkind. It was downright mean. You spoke the truth and your wife didn't like how she looked when you held up the mirror." - Prize-Bumblebee-2192
"Yeah, it sounds like the wife has reason not to like MIL, but instead of taking the high road she was cruel and a bully."
"This was petty and mean and really unkind. I hope it's just that your wife needs to grow up a bit (I was slow to learn compassion for others in my own life, so maybe she is the same?)."
I'm upset for you because she didn't take your feelings into account before this mean girl trick."
"You stood up for your wife with your mom, and I feel like she just sh*t all over that by not respecting the boundaries you worked for to maintain peace."
"You are NTA. Not sure what I would do about it. If your mom is aware that she was tricked it would be important for your wife to apologize."
"I feel like the friend who did the makeup is kind of an AH too." - situationship321
"NTA. It looks like you're going to have to set some boundaries with your wife. After you did that with your mom she behaved."
"You married a mean, childish, vindictive woman. The fact that she got defensive with you and called you a mamma's boy says so much about her."
"In the beginning, my mother was horrible to my husband-- both my first and second. Neither of my mils liked me much either."
"But we didn't resort to meanness or sniping. This could get to be a lifelong thing if it's not nipped in the bud."
"After getting firm with my mother: if you treat him badly I won't come around either, she relented. In the end, she seemed to like both my first and my second husband better than she liked me!"
"Most (not all) people can change if they have a good reason to."
"Suggestion: maybe couples counseling is in order? If how you approached this with your wife and her friends is accurate, you were not out of order; this is your mother fffs!"
"But they also sound terribly immature. Communication and respect are essential for a successful marriage. A counselor can help with this."
"Good luck." - cordelia1955
"NTA"
"Your wife sure is one though"
"If there's already a difficult relationship then what she did just made it worse, and giggling about it with her friends at dinner just makes it worse"
"She is a bully" - CrystalQueen3000
"'When they left my wife became very upset and said I should be on her side 100% not 95% and that I humiliated her by speaking to her friends like that. She accused me of being a mama's boy.'"
"'Presenting a united front' is not 'man agrees with whatever wife says.'"
"Your wife does not seem terribly nice..."
"NTA" - He_Who_Is_Person
"NTA - Is your wife 12?? She sacrificed her own wedding day pictures to humiliate and one-up your mom. She has the type of friends that gang up with her to behave this way too???"
"She could have gone the dignified and polite route and not tried to mean-girl her MIL, who was at least trying to behave that day."
"It would have been completely different had your mom acted up or tried to ruin things or cause issues that day. but she didn't - she was only there to support and celebrate."
"THAT makes your wife (and her cohorts) massive AH's."
"Might I suggest send ALL the pix off to someone that can photoshop your mother's face to normal so that there is no more proof that you married someone that felt this was acceptable behaviour?"
"Then bury the originals." - C_Alex_author
"NTA but your wife is. The expectation that you should side with your wife, not only against your mom's aggressions toward her..."
"...but also in her aggressions toward your mother, is really - I don't even know what to say. Just super problematic IMO."
"Is she going to be this nasty and get a group together to bully you the first time you really piss her off?" - mifflewhat
"NTA. But your wife is, and her friends. Expect worse behavior; your mom heard you, and adjusted her behavior, your wife doubled down and bullied you."
"If you love her and want a decent life, y'all need counseling to get on the same page about boundaries and loyalty."
"Shaman, pastor, therapist, whatever, you need another brain in this mix" - zaleli
"If your wife is this spiteful to your mother, think of what she'll do to you. This would be a relationship-ending scenario, and I'm one of the most forgiving people."
"This is incredibly cruel. I bet you if thought about it, you would see many more red flags in your relationship."
"NTA, but I think you should look hard at your wife and rethink the relationship." - Abject_Ad_2912
"NTA, she went to your mother's level and is surprised that what behavior you don't appreciate in your mother, you don't appreciate in her either."
"I would say the opposite of a mama's boy, she behaved just like your mother, mean." - Mimmutti_
Cruelty is not a good look on a new wife.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp