Navigating homophobia within one's own family can be tricky, particularly when it comes to older, more conservative family members.
But how important is it to show solidarity with your LGBTQ+ family members when it comes to inviting those homophobic relatives to an important life event, like a wedding?
Redditor aita-homophobic recently clashed with his queer cousins over this issue regarding his upcoming wedding, so he turned to the subReddit "Am I the A**hole" (AITA) to see if he's in the wrong.
He asked:
"AITA for being 'homophobic' by inviting my grandparents to my wedding?"
The original poster (OP) explained the circumstances.
"Fake names and throwaway account and whatnot. (I called the account 'aita-homophobic' but that was because it was an available username. I don't think I'm a homophobe)."
"I (21m[ale]) am getting married this summer. I am straight; my fiancée is a woman, obviously."
"I have two older cousins (29m and 26f[emale]) let's call them Mark and Jane, both of whom are openly gay/lesbian, respectively."
"My grandparents (87m and 79f) are unashamedly homophobic. They have attended every straight wedding in the family."
"They declined invitations to Mark and Jane's weddings because they 'don't believe that's a real marriage'."
Despite their faults, the OP doesn't want his grandparents to miss his wedding, even if it means hurting Mark and Jane.
"Here's the problem: Homophobia aside, my grandparents are amazing, hardworking, good people. I intend to invite them to my own wedding. Jane and Mark completely oppose this."
"Because I'm a bit of a 'golden boy' for the family, they want me to exclude my grandparents from my wedding to punish my grandparents and to 'promote marriage equality'. I refuse to listen to them."
This has caused a rift, which has made the OP feel a bit torn about his decision.
"Most of the family has taken my side (it's a very big family), except for Jane, Mark, their in-laws, and Mark's parents. They call me a homophobe and a terrible person or beg me not to invite my grandparents."
"I won't listen to them, but I feel somewhat sorry that I'm not fighting my grandparents for them. I can't help but feel like a bit of an a**hole for that."
"What do you think Reddit? AITA?"
After getting some responses, the OP edited his post to add a few more details.
"Thanks for the replies. I want to clarify one thing."
"My grandparents will be mostly respectful to Jane and Mark if they're all at the wedding. They call their spouses their 'boyfriend/girlfriend' and don't show that they're bothered by their relationship (unless someone straight up asks them)."
"I should also add that they don't hate Mark. Even though they dodged his wedding, they helped pay for his college tuition and he and his husband's house mortgage (they didn't do this for Jane (or Jane's straight brother) because they have conservative views on immigration and my grandparents are immigrants)."
Redditors weighed in on the situation by declaring:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
Most weren't too keen on the OP's decision.
"YTA. Your grandparents are bigots. That automatically disqualifies them from being amazing people."
"But, if you're good with having bigots in your family and showing them that you support their disgusting beliefs (by tolerating them, you're telling others that you agree with them, which is why they're calling you a homophobe) that's your prerogative."—debt2set
"I second this YTA. You have made it clear that you enjoy their favoritism. I am going to ask you a couple of questions that I hope help you decide."
"1. Will you regret making either choice? If the grandparents come vs the cousins? If so, do what you can live with."
"2. Will you have these cousins in your life? This is a decision that goes beyond one day."
"You're standing with hatred in their eyes. I understand the choice as you see it but I don't know if you're thinking about the future also."
"3. Do you feel good about this choice? This doesn't necessarily make it right or wrong. I don't know what my own choice would be as I'm not you."
"I do know it might be helpful to communicate feelings to cousins. 'I can't imagine my wedding without the old AHs. I know it hurts you but they're grandma and grandpa. Can we celebrate separately?'"
"They may say no but making an effort at acknowledging the horribleness of how they're treated and wanting them might be enough. It might not be."
"Just remember to ask yourself what changes for each choice and in the long run. Any favoritism is toxic with kids."
"You're benefitting from their toxic behavior and while it's easy to want to maintain that because it is comfortable? It does have a cost."—FirebirdWriter
"YTA and people like you are why these bigots never change, because even though you recognize they are terrible, you treat them well and include them in your life because they are nice to you."
"Your grandparents are not 'amazing, hardworking, good people' they are rotten and deserve to be shunned, not invited to weddings."—VROF
"I mean, you're prioritizing the comfort and inclusion of homophobes, and making sure they don't face consequences for their behavior, helping the world stay a more comfortable place to be a homophobe."
"So yeah, supporting other people's ability to be homophobic is actually homophobic, the same way that covering for racists is in itself racist."
"Real change and justice can't just come from the marginalized. It's the normalized population, the ones in positions of relative power (in this situation, that's you) who must help out."
"You can choose to let the opportunity pass by, but understand that in doing so, you're protecting your grandparents' homophobia. And that's homophobic."
"YTA"—rabidturbofox
There were a few who were a bit more sympathetic, however.
"Eh, as a gay man, he's NTA. It's his wedding, he can invite whoever he wants as long as they agree to act civil and respectful."
"A wedding is a day for the couple, not protests. What happens if he disinvites them and half his family doesn't come?"
"One of the things that all LGBTQ people must accept is that there will always be bigots, and we all need to learn how to deal with them."
"It looks a lot better to come in and act respectful and take the moral high ground rather than to make demands on loved ones. Let the bigots make themselves look bad."—Gojira085
"I'm gay as well, and I feel like this is a tough one. If it were me, I would't put pressure on a younger cousin to disinvite his/her grandparents if they have a great relationship with them."
"But by god sit all opposing parties as far away from each other as possible cause I wouldn't wanna be around homophobes either."
"NAH (except the grandparents)"—ayrainy
"NTA. It's your marriage, not a protest."
"I understand why your cousins are mad with their grandparents but if you love them and want them in your marriage, it's your decision and it doesn't make you an homophobe."
"It's also up to your cousins not to attend bc of the presence of their bigot grandparents, but it's not their place to tell you who to invite."—girl_in_red_costume
One Redditor's response that got a lot of traction gave the OP quite a bit to consider.
"Rather than leave a judgement, I'll give you my thoughts as a gay person:"
"I don't have the ability to think about things through the lens of 'homophobia aside.' All of that homophobia that others can put to the side is always front and center for us."
"It affects our employment, our safety, our mental health, and a lot of other areas of our lives that would otherwise be normal."
"But we're queer, so people can't leave well enough alone. I've had people threaten my employment just because I'm gay. People I didn't even know."
"Homophobes believe that queer people are less than. You just said they don't believe Jane's and Mark's respective marriages are real."
"They don't believe they're valid. They don't believe they deserve that happiness, or peace of mind."
"Imagine if your grandparents told YOU they didn't approve of your marriage and would not attend the wedding. How hurt would you be?"
"To see these people who, up until then, you had such a wonderful relationship with? What about Jane and Mark? How was it to find out that these people wouldn't attend?"
"And is it just the wedding? Have your grandparents failed to acknowledge them elsewhere?"
"Failed to treat them with the same respect they give everyone else? What goes on that maybe you don't see?"
"So now you have the grandparents coming to your wedding. And you've asked Jane and Mark to suck up the reminder that Grandma and Grandpa see them as lesser by the very act of your grandparents' presence, enjoying themselves, laughing, dancing."
"Stuff they'd never do for Jane and Mark, who at some point were kids I assume who looked up to them (and even if they weren't disowned, you don't get to accept queer people only when they fit in)."
"And by inviting them, the message you send is 'I know they treated you like sh*t, but they don't treat me like sh*t so, y'know, get over it.' You've established that your values are only your values insofar as the issue affects you and your own life directly."
"I know the grandparent situation is complicated. And I know you love them."
"But they have opinions about human beings tantamount to 'these people don't deserve rights.'" Or 'their love isn't real.'"
"Do yourself a favor and read up on just what kinds of problems queer couples face without marriage rights and try to put yourself in your cousins' shoes."
"Imagine that your own grandparents are the type of people to vote against your ability to see your terminal significant other in the hospital, get POA (power of attorney), assist in other affairs, you name it."
"Imagine that they would vote to leave you cold, alone, and scared, while your spouse is in the hospital because they find your existence and love offensive (and don't downplay it, just because you have the luxury of not seeing it that way)."
"There ARE wrong opinions. You can argue over pineapple on pizza all you want, but you don't get to have an opinion on whether a person's existence is valid."
"We're born as we are, but people like your grandparents are born into their opinions, and they can learn."
"You can't be friends with your friends' abusers OP. And homophobia is abuse."—Marmaladeanddryice
Hopefully the OP will take these comments to heart and figure out if it's really worth ostracizing his cousins in favor of his bigoted grandparents.
Perhaps taking a stand against homophobia will help his cousins finally feel like they're valued members of the family.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp