Grandparents can be the best form of help when a newborn arrives.
But that doesn't always mean the help needs to stay 24/7.
Also, with the arrival of family comes a lot of emotional bagged.
Childbirth is an already an emotionally charged experience.
So all of this may be too overwhelming for a parent who has just been through labor and delivery.
Case in point...
Redditor ThrowRA29573758 to discuss her experience and get some feedback. So naturally, she came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
She asked:
"AITA for getting upset I can't visit when my grandchild is born?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I am in my late 50s (F[emale]) and have two kids."
"My oldest daughter is going to give birth to her second child next month."
"Their father and I divorced about 18 years ago."
"I was a super young bride and did my best to raise my kids but my husband was 12 years older than me and was an alcoholic."
"Eventually, I had to go live my own life."
"I ended up moving to Sedona and getting into the spiritual community (we lived in N[ew] Y[ork])."
"My daughter was 20 and my son was 17 when I left - they were both off to college."
"I try to visit twice a year and spend time with my kids and grandson."
"I'm of a lower income bracket so I usually stay with my daughter."
"I was hoping to stay for the month next month, but my daughter told me that she strictly doesn't want me coming for the birth of her second child."
"She said I abandoned them and that I don't just get to show up for the good moments."
"She told me I can come in January if I want but I'll need to get a hotel room."
"I'm a little hurt because I really try to be helpful when I visit."
"I clean, I cook, and I babysit so she and her husband can go out."
"I know I live far away, but I'm not the first mother to not live in the same state."
"I make sure to visit at least twice a year and save up a significant amount to do it."
"I did get a bit upset on the phone and told her I wish she'd told me she was holding resentments earlier."
"She told me that she didn't have a home to stay in during college break because I just disappeared."
"We hung up angrily."
The OP was left to wonder:
"So AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP WAS the a**hole.
"I'm sorry to say but you are experiencing the consequences of your actions."
"You are the one who moved away."
"I can tell you honestly that even if a mother and daughter have a really solid relationship, it would be unreasonable to expect to be able to stay for a full month immediately after the birth of a grandchild."
"It's just too much, even for the best relationships."
"There clearly are unresolved issues and it's important to respect your daughter's wishes if you want to try and start repairing your relationship."
"I'd plan to visit near the time of birth (provided they are allowing visitors, ETA, or when your daughter has asked you to come, i.e. January) and stay nearby but only for a few days."
"You can try and visit again when you are able to."
"Gentle YTA - I know it hurts but you can build your relationship back and there can be healing if you put in the work." ~ IamIrene
"I wouldn't suggest going near the time of the birth, mum-to-be has been clear Mum is welcome to come in January provided she gets her own place to stay so I wouldn't try and push things." ~ chonk_fox89
"I definitely agree with this."
"Only come in January and get a hotel without questioning it or getting angry."
"She set her boundaries and OP needs to respect them if she wants to reconcile." ~ Empress-Palpetine
"No. It's okay for OP and daughter to be angry."
"It is not okay to put skewed feelings on another, thought."
"Maybe do some self-assessment as to why this makes you angry/reactionary."
"The daughter is being the host for this moment."
"Just giving birth puts her in a particularly vulnerable position too."
"Arguing will not make your possible visit something to look forward to, for her."
"Plus it's her house." ~ motherlymetal
"My husband's mom did this exact thing."
"The moment he was 18 and off to college, she sold their house and moved to another state."
"All of his belongings, his baby stuff, boxes, and memories were dumped on him before she left."
"He 100% felt abandoned."
"He wasn't at all ready to take on his entire life of belongings and start college without any support."
"He ended up moving around a lot and had to beg friends to hang onto his stuff and some then got lost or misplaced."
"It really sucked."
"Just because they are off to college, doesn't mean they are growing up."
"If I didn't have a home to go back to during those years, I'd feel abandoned too." ~ food_of_doom
"The daughter already gave OP a time to visit in the month after the birth."
"The daughter also changed from hosting her mom to a hotel, which makes me doubt OP is as 'helpful' as she thinks."
"Scheduling any visit outside those parameters is going to irritate the daughter, especially with a new baby."
"No coming and staying around the time of the birth after being told no."
"Follow the daughter's lead." ~ Shibaspots
"My mom stayed for 3 weeks when my son was born and... Yikes."
"Meant well, but I really wish I'd have had her come later."
"It was more work to host her than it was helpful."
"Sure, she held my son for me, but as a newborn, he really didn't need much because he was still a sleepy potato."
"A three-week visit would've helped so much more for her visit when he was 6 months old."
"She's also super irritating and judgy, so that doesn't make it any better." ~ LissR89
"My YTA isn't so gentle."
"OP moved so far away from her children to support her spirituality when one of them was still a teenager and the other barely an adult."
"She talks about how she's not the first mother to live in another state, but I think that's downplaying the over 3500kms she moved."
"Leaving her ex seems like a good idea, but that doesn't mean she has to move all the way to the other side of the country, or that she had to move that far away when her kids were still young."
"That was a choice she made, and pretending like it wasn't a big deal probably isn't helping her case." ~ haleorshine
"And for someone in a 'lower income bracket,' she chose a hella expensive place to live."
"Like, Sedona has a turquoise McDonald's because the only way they would allow the restaurant as if it didn't mess up their 'vibe.'" (Read: tourist-appealing cour schème.)
"Also YTA." ~ the_siren_song
"OP did not move away from her children, she straight up abandoned them with their alcoholic father and left them to fend for themselves."
"As a mom of a senior getting ready to graduate, the kid still needs both parents."
"OP is lucky to have contact with the grandkids." ~ Rough-Month7054
"To be honest, the thought of hosting someone for a month would give me incredible anxiety, even if I hadn't just given birth."
"Add dealing with healing after childbirth and tending to a newborn to the mix and I guarantee you it's not happening."
"Regarding the hurt your daughter brought up… it sounds like you have stayed with her in the past and that this felt somewhat out of the blue."
"So, while not wanting to invalidate her feelings, I wonder if pregnancy hormones brought back up the hurt she felt when you left?"
"Like, my pregnancy hormones had me going through mental files of experiences I hadn't thought of since they'd happened."
"But it was like my subconscious was working to identify potential threats and hurts for my unborn children… anyway, just a thought, in case you were bewildered by this."
"I'm going to go with a gentle YTA for expecting to stay for a month."
"I realize it comes from a good place, but that's a lot." ~ SunshineShoulders87
"YTA. When your adult daughter voices resentment over past pain you've caused, immediately criticizing her for not speaking up sooner is a tone-deaf response."
"How hard do you think it was to finally speak up for herself?"
"Of course, it's hard to hear."
"But criticism in such a vulnerable moment tells her she's not heard, and minimizes her feelings."
"The way you've recounted it here shows no effort to consider this from her P[oint] O[f] V[iew]; you sound like someone excusing yourself."
"Second, no one wants a houseguest for a month."
"That's just too long in someone else's space/life with the (possible) exception of long-distance romances."
"And even more so after a new baby. In that case, even a weeklong visit is a lot."
"Bottom line, you owe her an apology."
"And a good, healthy listen."
"Because you want to be a parent who knows your kid's heart, who she can be honest with, right?" ~ Jayseek4
"YTA. It is unreasonable and unfair to expect a woman who just gave birth to host you in her home for a month."
"You decided to leave your daughter - now you get to deal with the consequences."
"You made a choice and now she's making hers." ~ myshellly
"YTA. Wave away all the backstory."
"You want to go stay with your daughter for a month during the birth of her child. She said no."
"The end. It's her choice." ~ Shibaspots
Well OP, Reddit understands your daughter's choices.
While your intentions may be good, this situation isn't about your feelings.
You may need to give your daughter space to process her feelings.
There is a lot going on for her. Try to stay positive and the support her in the ways she needs.
Good luck.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp