Do children owe their parents? Is the privilege of being born an automatic IOU between parent and child?
Is a child ever responsible for a parent's hhappiness?
A daughter-in-law dealing with this conundrum turned to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit for feedback on her proposed solution by asking a Would I Be The A**hole (WIBTA) question.
Actual-Barracuda-975 asked:
"WIBTA if I told my mother-in-law (MIL) I don’t want her moving to our dream town?"
The original poster (OP) explained:
"My husband (30, male) and I (30, female) moved to State A a few years ago. Shortly afterward, my in-laws moved there too. Eventually we both got remote jobs, so we started talking about where we actually wanted to build our life."
"For our entire six-year marriage, we’ve dreamed of moving to a little coastal town we’ll call Beach Town. We’ve vacationed there for years, honeymooned there, and both love it. It’s our dream."
"Last year, we told my in-laws we were seriously considering moving there. In that same conversation, my MIL announced that she felt 'God was telling her' they needed to move there too. They had never even visited."
"We tried to roll with it and all went to Beach Town to look at apartments. The trip was bizarre. They followed us everywhere we went instead of making their own plans."
"When I suggested they explore for a few hours while we looked at apartments, my MIL started sobbing and hugged us like we were abandoning her."
"The whole trip felt suffocating. They mostly just followed us around like silent ghosts and didn’t contribute to conversation or even try to have fun. My husband and I left thinking, 'We absolutely do not want to move there with them'."
"So we moved back to our Home State instead. They followed us there too. At least there are 5 of my husband’s siblings nearby, so we figured it’s less pressure on us."
"A few weeks ago, I privately mentioned to my SIL that Beach Town is still on the table for us. We still think about it constantly, but I didn’t tell my in-laws."
"A few days later, my MIL randomly asked us, 'Are you guys thinking about moving to Beach Town when your lease is up?'."
"Then she said, 'We’ve wanted to live there for six years. That’s always been the plan'."
"I was so angry I had to leave the room and threw up in the bathroom."
"To be fair, my SIL didn’t share the info. I think my MIL was eavesdropping from another room. It was my fault for mentioning it in the first place probably."
"For context, my father-in-law (FIL) has cheated on her repeatedly for ~30 years, and sometimes I wonder if she’s vicariously living through us. I obviously can’t know that, but she frequently copies our plans while my FIL seems completely indifferent and just goes along with her."
"We’ve told them that if we eventually move to Beach Town, we don’t want them basing their plans around ours."
"Their response? 'We aren’t following you. We’re following God'."
"And honestly, that makes me even angrier. It feels incredibly insulting to have our six-year dream repeatedly hijacked and then be told it’s just 'God'."
"I know we don’t own Beach Town. I can’t tell them where they can live. I just want some space, I don’t want to feel responsible for uprooting their lives again."
"Can’t a girl have a little whimsy and adventure without her MIL coming along and killing the vibe?"
"WIBTA if I bluntly told her that we really don’t want them moving there with us?"
"I already know she’ll cry."
Redditors weighed in using the AITA voting acronyms:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
- INFO - more information needed
Redditors decided the OP would not be the a**hole (NTA/WNBTA).
"NTA. Seems a little weird to me if I’ll be honest with you. On the other hand the evil in me would tell them that you were actually planning to move somewhere else then move where you originally wanted to without telling them." ~ Mufasa12-13
"Imagine putting on an elaborate ruse. Using an AirBnB rental in some distant town in the opposite direction and everything. Paying a realtor to pretend to be showing the place, for a private sale, with the in-laws in tow."
"Then announcing the closing, the stuff is moved in and now you finally went on that extended dream trip to Europe or wherever while it could still be done."
"Upon 'returning', with in-laws settled in, announce that God told us, at the last moment, to go back to the original plan." ~ Scenarioing
"I was thinking you were going even more elaborate. You let them think you bought and live in the Airbnb."
"When the in-laws want to visit you book yourself the same Airbnb, put up a couple personal photos and welcome them into your home." ~ Artistic-Baseball-81
"Since she believes God is directing her, you should use that tactic and tell her you prayed on it too and God is telling you your MIL should not move to Beach Town. That God told you she needs to find her own path to Him, not follow her son and DIL, and that Beach Town is not his plan for her."
"Remind her she didn’t even like it there. God doesn’t want her to be unhappy. Ask her if God has mentioned other places that he feels would make her closer to God and not her son."
"Ask her why God would want her to ignore her other children and grandchildren to focus on this one child. She has six. Why is she obsessed with your husband? A godly mother should treat all her children equally."
"Sometimes religious people who feel they are following God’s plan need to be given a different interpretation of what they think they hear. If she won’t listen to you or your husband, tell her to really listen to God. It’s your only argument." ~ Malibucat48
"I’ve heard there are demons living beneath town hall in Beach Town. I think God would frown on them moving here." ~ SueShe19
"Your husband has 5 siblings? Why is she fine leaving them (and grandkids)? Your husband is the one who needs to have a convo with her."
"Make sure he really is on the same page as you. Enlist his siblings' help to tell her they'd miss them too much. How hard it was for when they moved to another state. Would none of them help their brother that way?" ~ Jaded_Tourist2057
"I don't want this to come across wrong, as I generally have a soft spot for old people and family is critically important. But I'm already sick of your MIL."
"And I've only known her for 90 seconds.If you guys do move to BeachTown, it had better be a really big house. On stilts. With LOOOOTS of stairs. No elevator." ~ Toby__H
"You say she's latched onto you because you're the only ones that check on her or spend time with her. Time to start withdrawing this type of activity."
"Don't check in as often and don't hang out as often either."
"It's not your job to make them happy or even make her happy. She has to do that herself." ~ Powerful_Put_6977
"She may cry, crying is often a manipulation tactic and wielded like a weapon. See it for what it is and it will make asserting yourself easier." ~ Correct_Cat4414
"So what if she cries? We aren't responsible for other people's emotions and inability to cope. It's okay if she cries and she is an adult who can learn to cope. It's not your job to make her life totally comfortable at your expense." ~ sisterfunkhaus
"You can be kind about it but you and your husband need some clear communication or this is just going to become simmering resentment. Its already gone on for 6 years. That's enough. NTA." ~ Actual-Barracuda-975
"Cry right back at her and see how she reacts. Or just say 'We can see you are having difficultly regulating yourself, we'll end this visit/call now and try again when you have gathered yourself.' then hang up/leave." ~ scunth
"You’re not responsible for her having a life…there are many hobbies she can start, and get friends around her age. Divorce is also an option, though some women like to act like it’s not. Her marriage seems unhappy…."
"But honestly this shouldn’t you be your problem, it’s your husband’s responsibility. It’s up to him to tell his own parents to stop following you guys around."
"I had narcissistic parents, and they used to do the same thing (not saying she’s a narcissist). Whenever my siblings & I moved somewhere together, they would shortly follow along. It’s a form of codependency and enmeshment." ~ Low-Maize2396
"I mean this in the healthiest way possible. It doesn't matter why she cries. It's not your responsibility to discern nor is it your responsibility to cure her loneliness. She is an adult who made the decisions that got her to where she is. If she is lonely, she can find other women to hang with."
"I was lonely, so I joined a library book club and met women that way. Now I go to a women's game night on Fridays and have made friends. I go to another private women's book club as well, and we meet weekly and have so much fun. I also meet women through volunteering. There are a bazillion ways to meet other women."
"My mom is lonely in her marriage, so she goes to church and is in choir and a part of a women's group. They all go to lunch regularly. They support each other and talk on the phone. There are Unitarian Universalist churches if you aren't religious. Lots of atheists go."
"My point is, no matter the reason, it's not your problem to solve. If it's manipulation, you ignore it. If it's loneliness, that's something that's up to her to fix instead of dumping it on you guys. You two need boundaries." ~ sisterfunkhaus
OP needs to decide if they want their marriage to center around herself and her husband or his mother. If she doesn't want her world to revolve around making his mother happy, then some boundaries are going to be needed.
Expectant Dad Of Two Livid After Brother Questions Why He'd Bring Another Kid Into Bleak World
It's no secret that a lot of people are struggling right now, from the cost of living to job insecurity to food insecurity to poor housing. But that doesn't mean we have to stop living.
For many people, that means still starting and growing their families, while planning how to navigate the world we're currently in, pointed out the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor DesignerOwn1141 and his wife knew that the world around them wasn't at its best right now, but they were eager to grow their family and were excited to bring a third child into the world.
When they announced their pregnancy, his brother's first reaction was to send him articles about how the world was doomed and shame him for bringing a child into it; the Original Poster (OP) wondered if he needed to block his own brother.
He asked the sub:
The OP and his wife were excited to welcome a third child into their family.
"I am 33 and male. My wife is 29."
"We have two sons, a six-year-old boy and a three-year-old boy. Both are happy, healthy, and well taken care of."
"We love being parents to them, and I work very hard to provide a good life for my family."
"My wife is four months pregnant with our third."
The OP's brother's life was very different from his.
"My younger brother has been something of a failure-to-launch case."
"Despite having every advantage, he never got good grades in school, was addicted to 'League of Legends' so severely that he barely scraped by, and spends his days streaming games to nearly no viewers on Twitch."
"I've watched his stream a few times, but he just rages constantly."
"My wife is too classy to ever say so, but I can tell he makes her uncomfortable."
"He's my brother, so I've long wanted to believe he's just bad at communicating with people, but to be frank, he's sort of just an a**hole. He's unapologetic whenever he says something hurtful and more likely to just double down and say, 'No cap.'"
"But if anyone so much as challenges his views, he throws a huge fit."
The OP tried to share his happy news with his brother, but his brother immediately squandered it.
"Recently, we announced she was pregnant with our third child. It's a joyous occasion for us because we wanted three children, and our other two sons are excited about having another brother or sister."
"When I texted my brother the news, he immediately said he couldn't imagine having children with the world the way it was."
"I asked what he meant, and he started sending me these articles about global warming, the plague in Russia, wars around the world, and so on."
"He seems convinced that the world is going to end in ten years tops, and that I'm only bringing up another child to die in the 'water wars.'"
"I was honestly disgusted with him. To tell someone that their unborn child is going to die, that their other children are going to die, is absolutely abhorrent behavior."
"But since he's always been a sensitive s**thead, I just said, 'Whatever, man,' and stopped reading his texts."
"He wouldn't stop. He kept sending me every doomer article. He said that when the clouds evaporate, the earth is going to get 15 degrees hotter. He said that AI is going to hack every government database. He said that China is going to invade Taiwan, and then it'll be war with the US and allies against Russia, China, North Korea, and Iran."
The OP had had enough of his brother's negative feedback.
"Finally, I just told him I was blocking him and thought little of the decision."
"He went and cried to our parents (again, he's the most sensitive s**tbag in the world), and they told me what I did was over the top."
"I know that if I unblock him, he's just going to doomspam me again."
"Am I wrong for just straight-up saying I never want him in my life again?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that they understood why he felt the need to distance himself from his brother.
"NOR. He sounds insufferable."
"He sounds like one of those people who doesn't like his life and so wants everyone else to be miserable too, or makes excuses for why he didn't do more with his life by blaming his problems on some external crisis." - savingrain
"NOR. He's allowed to protect his peace, especially if his brother keeps ignoring boundaries and turning every conversation into another end-of-the-world prediction, and having kids is hardly a reason to apologize for trying to build a good life despite everything going on." - Upper-Cloud9097
"NOR. But your brother is on his way to a full mental breakdown. Send him back cute dog and cat videos. Cute horse videos. Ozzy animal voiceovers."
"Eventually his phone will start thinking he's like me and his feed will calm down." - Present_Original_797
"I mean, my beliefs and thoughts about the future are along the same lines as him, and that’s why I’m an anti-natalist, but there’s something called tact. And personal choice/autonomy."
"If someone chooses to have kids, that’s their choice, and I’d keep my opinions to myself and be supportive, especially if they’re a family member. Spreading doomer content is extremely insensitive and rude. NOR." - EngineerGold4242
"NOR: I wonder whether your brother is displaying sibling jealousy towards you and your family; he recognizes his own shortcomings and can see where he is in life compared to you, and that is his major issue."
"Days filled with unfulfilling computer games and doomspamming others, he has a lot of maturing to do. Block him until or unless he decides to join the adult world and be the uncle he is supposed to be." - iron_redditman
"NOR. I have all those fears and as such actively avoid news about them. I skipped whole paragraphs here for that reason too, lol."
"I’d definitely block my sibling or anybody else who did that to me. I already know all these things; I don’t need constant reminders. All I can do is work on improving my little corner of the world and trudge forward."
"Anyway, protect your peace." - hahagato
"You are not obligated to bond with someone just because you share blood. It’s your peace and your family that you need to protect now. If you decide to go zero contact, it’s perfectly okay!"
"Especially because you and your wife are in charge of two, almost three, little guys, and your mental peace affect directly to them."
"PS. Historically, the world has always been on the edge, but nothing stops us to be what we are, humans trying to get over all the s**t! So don’t let those bad things put you down. We can build a better world by raising kind, lovely people, and it seems you and your wife are doing it. Good luck!" - Camigatoespinace92
Others advised the OP to involve his parents in case they could help his brother.
"Unblock him and then send everything he texts you to both mom and dad. No comments, just forward it."
"They'll think you're sending it, and when they complain, you can tell them that you thought they'd be interested in your brother's articles as well."
"NOR." - No_Address687
"NOR. Your parents don't know the half of it. Forward everything and let them read it for themselves." - Available_Agent3305
"NOR. I’d keep him blocked; your parents are wrong. If you want to be petty, start sending your parents article after article of stuff you know they won’t like. They will get the hint soon enough." - OldieButNotMoldy
"I would also go low contact with the OP's parents. OP is clearly NOT the favorite son. Any boundaries he put up with his brother will be considered wrong. NOR." - Interesting_Novel997
"NOR, but also my first reaction is that your brother isn't a 'sensitive s**tbag,' he is struggling with anxiety/depression and maybe undiagnosed neurodivergence and is drowning in his own ruminations. None of that makes this an appropriate response to a pregnancy announcement; it's clearly not. But he sounds like someone who is clearly struggling here."
"If it were me, I'd be sending your parents anything he previously sent you. If they share your concern after reading a few articles, maybe they'll take steps to help him." - 2kidsnomoney---
"NOR. I'm sorry to say this, OP, but your brother has not been socialized normally. He is a chronically online loser who thinks he can do and say whatever he wants and does not understand there are no consequences because there are often no consequences when he does it in a league match or online."
"It frankly sounds like your concern for him and his future is budding into resentment and contempt, and I feel like, as most brothers would, those are not the feelings you want to hold towards him."
"I have a brother like this. He was diagnosed as an adult with Asperger’s and now just a spectrum autism diagnosis, but he’s a real a**."
"You may have to unblock him to communicate fairly. It may be worth doing this in person because it’s easier for the chronically online to 'craft' their retort rather than be a part of a conversation."
"Before you can do that, though, you need to sit down with your parents. You need to explain and be able to articulate that:"
"1. His reaction to the wonderful news of you having another child crossed the line and was inappropriate."
"2. There need to be reasonable consequences or boundaries because you are no longer willing to put up with that."
"3. It is his call at this point whether or not he wants to be in your life and your children’s lives."
"You have to have their buy-in; otherwise they are just going to continue to coddle and enable this behavior."
"Then you need to sit down with him and your parents, intervention style. You need to present the same argument you did to your parents, and in all honestly, I would question him in return: what was he hoping would have been the outcome of that conversation?"
"Did he want you to say he’s so right, so smart? Did he want you to go to your wife and tell her to abort? Does he feel like he is in a place in his life where he can be your family planner and manager? When he crosses a line, what does he feel should happen?"
"Only when he is directly confronted, and you have the right supports in place, can he be presented with how his behavior affected you and what that could possibly mean for his relationship with you and your growing family." - allison_mossie
The subreddit understood feeling burdened by so much negative information during what should be a happy time of planning and anticipating a new addition to the family, but the OP needed time to think about what he wanted his larger family dynamic to look like.
That might mean removing his brother, so that the OP could protect his own, and by extension, his wife's and children's, mental health, but it might mean minimizing contact with other people, too, if they weren't willing to respect the OP's boundaries he had for his family's life.