If there's one thing all parents and teachers have in common, it's that they never want children to feel left out or excluded.
With this in mind, teachers often go to great lengths to ensure that their students get to know every member of their class as well as possible, while parents also go to great lengths to make sure their children don't glom onto only one other child.
However, there are some rare cases where including everyone simply isn't possible.
Specifically, birthday parties.
Redditor Better-Ad9523 was a bit surprised to find her son's teacher didn't approve of the final guest list for her son's birthday party.
Despite the fact that the original poster (OP) told her that was the maximum she could accommodate.
When her son's teacher stood firm, the OP eventually came up with a solution that finally persuaded her to stop.
After being scolded by her husband for her actions, the OP took to the subReddit "Am I The A**hole" (AITA), where she asked fellow Redditors:
"AITA for suggesting my teacher host my son's party at her house?"
The OP explained why she found herself at odds with her son's teacher, owing to his birthday party:
"I realize this was probably very petty but I want to see if I am justified or just an ahole and owe an apology."
"My son "Sam" had his ninth birthday today, but we're having the actual "party" tomorrow night, which is basically just a sleepover at our apartment with two friends."
"One is in his class and the other in a different one(same school though)."
"Before my son even got home from the bus I got a call from his teacher "Lorna" requesting that the party involve all the students in the class."
"She learned about it because it came up as the class wished him a happy birthday."
"I at first politely refused, saying that's not reasonable but she insisted to make sure nobody was left out."
"I respond by saying that she has no say in who is at my home ever and that even if she did, my apartment simply cannot accommodate 32 kids and guardians."
"She says that because other students are involved, she does and that I should have the party somewhere that can allow all students."
"I was ready to either hang up or tell her off, but what she said at the end sparked an idea."
"I tell her 'Okay, what's your address?' and when she asks why, I told that since you think you have a say and you want all your students to be a part, we might as well have the party have her house, and request her address again."
"There's a pause before she says that's not exactly what she meant and I tell her that no, she wants everyone to attend so she should be the one to make it work, before hanging up."
"This is where I probably became the a**hole."
"Out of curiosity I easily found her address(her SM is not private at all) and email her 'how does this email sound?' with an excerpt to the group email chain saying that Lorna has offered to host Sam's birthday party at her home and to come after school to X address."
"I was NOT planning on actually sending that to anyone else but her. I just wanted to prove the point. I felt I was being sarcastic, but I know tone is hard online."
"She responded to not send it and to do whatever I want for the birthday, she does not care anymore."
"When I vented to my husband about it, he called me unhinged, but he agreed with my point. I'll admit, I have a bit of a habit going overboard when I feel wronged and probably went nuts, but I can't believe the audacity of this lady."
"AITA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in on where they believed the OP fell in this particular situation, by declaring:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
- NAH – No A**holes Here
The Reddit community had trouble sympathizing with both the OP and Lorna.
While just about everyone agreed that Lorna was being unreasonable in demanding that the OP include every member of Sam's class, as this was a party involving two children, not a party involving everyone BUT two children.
They also felt the OP crossed the line by sending the email, with many agreeing with the OP's husband that her behavior bordered on "unhinged."
"ESH."
"It's one thing if the whole class was invited and just one of 2 kids were excluded."
"But in this case it's just a sleepover with 2 friends."
"That was any basic weekend when I was a kid."
"But you doubled down and made it creepy by finding her address."- firewifegirlmom0124
"ESH."
"As a teacher, wow."
"Wild."
"Lorna is part of the broken education system."
"It's unfortunate that your kid landed in her room, but I hope this was a random one-off and that she is typically a good teacher."
"However, you quickly went from being deeply justified and right to possibly opening yourself up to legal ramifications... especially with the paper trail evidence you so willingly created."
"Public schools teachers have protections and rights."
"You may have ventured into territory that can range from banning from all school property and events up to and including restraining orders, PFAs, and charges."
"Flip the script, in the teachers sub reddit, if this was posted from Lorna's POV, there would be 100s of comments suggesting 'forward to admin, union along with all communications and documentation of parent' and from a union rep perspective, I've encouraged staff to pursue all legal paths to protect their teaching license and certifications."
"The old adage hits true here: two wrongs don't make a right."
"I tell my students comply, then complain."
"The second you pop off (like researching, premediating, her address--doubtful her home address is listed on her Facebook, Instagram, etc... you looked elsewhere), you eliminate any real, justified complaint you had."
"Sooner rather than later, you need to send an extremely sincere apology, explanation of being caught off guard and reactive to her request, recognize that things could have been handled better by both parties, BUT most importantly, this miscommunication between adults should not affect the learning environment for any of the students in the room."
"Selfish plug."
"The teacher shortage is real."
"Lorna is still better than no one... or that class size of 42."
"We are on the same team with you, parents."- abedilring
"ESH, you had me applauding up until you mentioned finding her address."
"She could construe that as a threat and take up the administrative chain, resulting in your son being removed from her class or possibly even local authorities getting involved."- sitvisvobiscum001
"ESH."
"I was with you until you found the teacher's address and let them know."
"That's dangerous behavior."
"Don't be surprised if you never get to chaperone a school event again."- cakeresurfacer
"ESH."
"It is wrong of the teacher to push you to throw a party (it's not like the son passed out invitations infront of others) to make sure no one is left out."
"However, you searching their personal information is creepy and intrusive _ very unhinged behavior."
"Yes, I agree the audacity, but since you admitted this is a habit of yours, I would consider looking into other methods because this can land you into hot water, if it hasn't already."- AVeryBrownGirlNerd
"ESH."
"I mean... asking her to do it at hers got your point across."
"The e-mail was just beating the dead horse to be extra."
"Is the teacher an idiot?"
"Yes."
"Decidedly."
"Their job ends when the kids go home unless there's distinct signs a child needs assistance beyond that (abusive households and the like)."
"Trying to dictate someone's child's birthday party is insane."
"But if you were upset enough to write up that e-mail, you could have made it one that goes to the principal instead and details the teacher's problematic behavior so she'd get reprimanded."
"You picked the high schooler response over the adult one, and no matter how 'funny' that is in theory, in practice, all you've done is made it so neither you nor the teacher can enter an interaction normally ever again (or at least until this is settled properly)."
"She teaches your son."
"You might want to ensure talking grades and stuff is not the most unpleasant and awkward situation to go through ever."- Schattentochter
"Your poor child."
"Hope that teacher doesn't take it out on your kid (she will)."
"Sometimes you have to control your temper for the wellbeing of your children."
"ESH."- GailaMonster
It is a teacher's job to make sure no student is being intentionally excluded or ostracized.
Which clearly wasn't the case with Sam's birthday party.
However, as frustrating as Lorna's behavior was, the OP could and should have taken the high road in explaining why that simply wasn't possible. As many have pointed out, her behavior might instead have gotten her in much worse trouble with Sam's school.
Only time will tell...
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp