Who gets let off the wedding guest list can be a controversial topic.
This decision can have lifelong repercussions for close relationships.
Family and friend dynamics can be altered forever.
So that's why it's good to think long and hard about 'why' someone would be left out.
Is it worth the stress?
Redditor DehydratedDolphin wanted to discuss his experience and get feedback, so he naturally joined the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subreddit.
He asked:
"AITA for telling my best friend he can't bring his wife to my wedding?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
I (29 M[ale]) attended my B[est] F[riend]'s (Josh 29 M) wedding a few years ago as the best man and was denied a plus one even though I had a G[irl]F[riend] (Stacey 28 F[emale])."
"When Josh and his now wife Amber (30 F) originally got engaged, they invited me to their wedding, and even though I was single, I was given a plus 1."
"A few months after being invited I told Josh I started dating Stacey and would be bringing her."
"Now for background, I have known Stacey for about 8 years, and we dated for a few months back in college."
"I originally met Stacy through Josh since she was a friend of Josh's ex-girlfriend."
"But when Josh and his ex broke up, the ex made Stacey decide between dating me or staying friends with her."
"She was a very toxic person."
"Stacey chose to keep dating me and, after all these years, has not talked to or been friends with the ex."
"However, me and Stacey ended up breaking up in college due to her transferring to a new college and neither of us wanting a long-distance relationship."
"Once Amber found out I started dating Stacey, she had a talk with Josh, which ended with Amber telling Josh I wasn't allowed to bring Stacey since she used to be friends with Josh's ex."
"When Josh broke the news to me, he told me Amber had the final decision, and she doesn't want Stacey at the wedding."
"And to add insult Josh told me I still had a plus one still, just can't be Stacey."
"Josh told me he didn't agree with Amber, but he didn't want to fight with her."
"After this conversation, I didn't mention anything to Stacey."
"Stacey knew the wedding was coming and would occasionally ask me if she was invited."
"I would tell her I wasn't sure if I had a plus 1 and kept pushing it off."
"We still had about 8 months until their wedding so I was hoping going on double dates and hanging out with the 4 of us would warm Amber up to Stacey and change her mind."
"This didn't work. Amber never changed her mind."
"The wedding came around (which was also on Stacey's birthday), and I reluctantly attended solo as the best man."
"I told Stacey everything, which really pissed her off."
"She wasn't upset with me and understood why I still wanted to attend the wedding, but she still hasn't forgiven Amber."
"Fast forward to now, Stacey and I are engaged."
"The roles are reversed, and Stacey is okay with Josh attending but doesn't want Amber near our wedding."
"Both Stacey's family and my family all know about Stacey not being invited to Josh and Amber's wedding and why."
"It's left a sour taste in everyone's mouth and neither of our families want Amber to attend."
"I'm not one for drama and really wish everyone got along especially since Josh has been my best friend since we were kids."
"But I'm standing by Stacey and Amber will not be invited."
The OP was left to wonder:
"So Reddit, AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP was NOT the a**hole.
"NTA. Fair's fair."
"If Josh's (now) wife had the final decision in who got to attend their wedding when they were in the process of planning their wedding, then it's only fair that your future wife gets to have the final say in who attends your wedding."
"Plus, like someone else said in the comments, if Josh's wife dislikes Stacey so much just because she used to be friends with Josh's ex-girlfriend, then she probably won't want to attend your wedding anyway." ~ mpurdey12
"100% chance she expects to be invited."
"You know the rules don't apply to women like her, don't you??"
"She will be a victim when she finds out she's getting back what she dished out and guaranteed she tries to force her husband to stop being friends with OP."
"Wait for it."
"NTA but look to the skies for dramatic fireworks because they are coming! 🤷🏼♀️." ~ Can-GingerGirl
"NTA, but if Josh has any sense he'll do what you should have done and RSVP that he won't attend." ~ phyrsis
"I wouldn't invite her either, but Josh's wife is going to forbid him to come to your wedding, and since he caved before, he'll probably cave now."
"You know, because he 'doesn't wanna fight with her.'" ~ wordsmythy
"Exactly this."
"I just replied the same thing in another comment."
"If OP goes through with not inviting her, Josh won't be allowed to go and he won't have the b*lls to stand up to her."
"Ultimately, even though OP is NTA for reciprocating, this move is going to cost the friendship."
"Women like Amber will ensure this is the final straw for Josh and OP."
"They will either have to secretly remain friends or both move on after the wedding unfortunately." ~ Crankshaft57
"I agree."
"OP needs to make sure he talks through this scenario with his fiancée and is okay with Josh not coming to the wedding."
"Additionally, there is a difference here."
"Amber and Josh are married now whereas Stacey and OP were a newish couple just dating."
"Now, was OP the AH for going to Josh and Amber's wedding without his girlfriend at the time specifically because of why Amber wouldn't allow her to go?"
"I would be on the fence for that one." ~ JCandle
"This whole section here should be highlighted and further up."
"OP, Josh isn't going to be allowed to go, and honestly, your friendship is over."
"The only reason it's continued is because Amber got her way with you at the wedding, Stacey was left at home, and YOU were the bigger person."
'When the shoe is on the other foot and Josh needs to do what you did, he's not going to do it."
"Josh set your friendship aflame back at his wedding."
"It'll be your wedding where that flame is going to get big enough to make a friendship hard between the two of you, if not end it all together." ~ WishingDandelions
"Yep, OP is NTA but needs to be prepared for the eventual outcome that Josh is not coming to the wedding if this is the route OP takes."
"Unfortunately, I don't really see a scenario where Josh attends the wedding and Amber doesn't."
"It's one thing for OP to have gone to a wedding without his relatively new girlfriend."
"It'll be another thing for Josh to go to a wedding without his wife of several years."
"He will side with his wife, and it may have repercussions for years to come."
"My hunch is to tell Amber to take a hike, but it might, might be better longer term to just invite her, sit her at the back of the hall, photoshop her out of the photos, and ignore her."
"Good luck OP…" ~ jupfold
"NTA, tell him he can have a plus 1, but it can't be Amber!!" ~ sarcastic-pedant
"You didn't invite Stacey to your wedding because she was friends with Josh's ex so unless you had a time machine to change that, you won't be invited to ours since as it stands, Stacey was still friends with his ex"
"You and Stacey don't owe Amber an invitation since she can't behave like an adult."
"I get it was her wedding and she gets the final say on the guest list but imagine holding something so petty against someone who had no control over who her husband dates."
'"I'm not one for drama and really wish everyone got along especially since Josh has been my best friend since we were kids.'"
"Josh obviously didn't hold the same sentiment since it was his wedding, too, and he wasn't willing to fight for your friendship."
"I wonder if he would still turn up to your wedding anyway without Amber."
"That would definitely tell you where you stand."
"But seriously though you need to be very clear to Josh and not be one of those people that beat around the bush about telling him and causing arguments between you and Stacey because she feels she has to be the bad guy while you just 'back her up.'"
"It's YOUR job to tell him straight and not wait until the invite goes out and he questioned why his invite doesn't have a plus one then Stacey will probably get the blame for being 'petty and holding a grudge.'"
"NTA but you would be if you don't have a word with Josh now." ~ SweetBekki
"NTA. Tell him before invites, everything you've told us."
"If you want to fix it."
"Propose double dates so they can become friendly and a chance for Amber can warm up and apologize."
"You're likely to lose a friend." ~ Baustin1345
"NTA, you reap what you sow."
"So, in this instance, turnaround is fair play."
"Sounds like you should have this discussion with your friend, and if he doesn't understand, then it makes him a hypocrite." ~ Prestigious_Past2701
"NTA. I also think Amber would not expect to be invited anyway if she dislikes Stacey so much." ~ Interesting-Tip-2962
"NTA. Is the whole tit-for-tat petty, yes, but neither your partner nor either of your families wants Amber there, so in my mind, it's an easy decision and a consequence of her own actions." ~ Bean-Penis
"NTA. Be very clear that you are just reciprocating Amber's very specific hospitality."
"Although I find it odd she was fine socializing with Stacy prior to the wedding." ~ phtcmp
"NTA... they opened that can of worms basing their decision off of who Stacey was friends with, not off of something Stacey was actually responsible for." ~ Urbanyeti0
Reddit is with you, OP.
Your fiancée and your friend's wife are both being a bit petty.
It's sad that you guys are caught in the middle.
Maybe the four of you should sit down and have a real heart-to-heart.
Hopefully, the ladies can bury the hatchet.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp