A wedding invite is not meant to be a suggestion.
Couples are serious about their choices when planning.
But then again, sometimes the lines can seem blurred.
There is always that saying, better to ask for forgiveness than permission.
Though, that doesn't seem to apply.
Case in point...
Redditor Suspicious_Tonight61 wanted to discuss her experience and get some feedback. So naturally, she came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
She asked:
"AITA For bringing my daughter to a childfree wedding?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I, 32 F[emale], have a 15-year-old daughter."
"My sister, 35 F, got married last week."
"I was her M[aid] o[f] H[onor]."
"My sister said that no children would be allowed at her wedding as they are loud and noisy."
"I brought my 15-year-old daughter because her aunt was getting married, and she wanted to wish her well!"
"At the wedding, my parents were shooting me daggers, and my sister came over furious."
"She asked, 'Who was I to completely disregard her rules?'"
"I was confused until she pointed out that my daughter should not be there."
"I argued, saying that the reason she didn't want children there was because they would misbehave."
"My daughter was silent, never on her phone, and was extremely respectful."
"I left the wedding early, and my parents are blowing up my phone with angry texts."
"My husband agrees with me but says I could have handled the situation better."
"My sister is refusing to speak with me until I apologize, but I don't think I did anything wrong."
"So, AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP WAS the A**hole.
"YTA - Hi internet, I did a thing I was specifically asked not to do, AITA?"
"Yes, you definitely are." ~ rhomboidus
"I get that from an appropriateness standpoint, but for behavioral reasons?"
"If I hear that it's child-free because kids are disruptive, I'm thinking they mean little kids who can't sit through the ceremony, not a well-behaved 15-year-old who's no more disruptive than any other guest."
"Especially when the 15-year-old and the bride have a good relationship."
"She still should have asked, though, because on the other hand, the daughter wasn't specifically invited, and the bride likely assumed +1 meant OP's husband." ~ dogsarefun
"Yeah, but the problem is that someone else who left their 15-year-old at home sees yours and is mad at your sister (the bride) for having a double standard and excluding their sweetly behaved princess but letting yours in."
"And since the rule breaker, in this case, is the bride's sister, she was probably seated at a very visible table, so the whole room got a good look."
"Now the bridal couple has to deal with hurt feelings and possible hostility from other family members."
"And if the bride was trying to form bonds with her new in-laws, and some of them had teenagers they left at home, she has a problem."
"For her new extended family will think she doesn't care about their kids, but only about her family's."
"YTA, OP. Causing that kind of potential trouble for your own sister is a new kind of stabbing in the back." ~ Artistic-Blackberry9
"Yeah to me, there is a difference between 'child-free' and 'adult only.'"
"A teenager who is well-behaved, quiet etc etc."
"I wouldn't really consider an issue in a 'child-free' space but would be an issue in an 'adult only' space."
"That said, I'm a little perplexed as to why OP didn't check first."
"I would at least ask the question to verify."
"There could be issues for reasons as simple as the Bride being concerned about other guests causing a fuss seeing a 15-year-old when they left their 12-year-old at home."
"Though I definitely understand we all make bad choices sometimes when we presume we know the answer, so I'd say a soft YTA to OP." ~ ummmwhut
"OP, stop the BS."
"YTA for so many reasons, including trying to pull the hip waders over our eyes."
"Bride is your sister."
"You were the MAID OF HONOR."
"You Knew it was child-free."
"You never asked YOUR SISTER, the bride, about bringing your daughter."
"OP, apologize."
"Your sister and your daughter deserved better."
"You put both of them in a bad position."
"Good luck on your journey towards evolution, edification, and enlightenment, OP."
"Your family deserves a better version of you." ~ No-Net8938
"What's telling to me is that, in the second edit, OP states that their husband didn't go because they were 'suddenly' called out of town on business."
"But they RSVP'd two people."
"So either this is the worst way of stating that she swapped out her husband for her daughter, thinking that was okay, or she just planned on bringing her daughter without intending to feed someone."
"Not sure which is worse, but in all cases OP is TA." ~ Hotelroombureau
"YTA - while I agree that a well-behaved 15-year-old isn't a child and should be allowed at a wedding, you absolutely should have cleared it first with your sister."
"I think you played dumb on purpose because you knew your sister would have said no."
"And now you're just surprised she isn't letting you get away with it scot-free." ~ neoncactusfields
"You could have asked?"
"When you say childfree, what age is the limit? Can I bring my daughter? No? Ok, it's your wedding, and I understand"
"It was that simple. 20-second phone call."
"You didn't do any of that because you're an AH and just wanted to get your way, and now you're hoping for random internet strangers to say you're N.T.A so you could rub it in your sister's face." YTA." ~ FunnyGum0_0
"YTA. Personally, I had a childfree wedding, and I wouldn't qualify a 15-year-old as a child in that context, but it's not my call, and it certainly wasn't yours."
"You didn't ask for clarification before bringing her and got defensive with the bride."
"Just apologize and say you should have asked and move on."
"This isn't worth causing further family drama." ~ dubyadubya
"I think a big thing is that while a well-mannered 15-year-old clearly wouldn't cause any problems, the bride will probably get sh*t from other parents who arranged for childcare after seeing that someone else's kid was allowed to come."
"OP is TA for not thinking about the ripple effect of her actions." ~ thrwy_111822
"Yeah, OP is in the wrong, but it's such a vast overreaction of the bride to be 'furious' and the parents to be 'shooting daggers' and sending angry texts because a 15-year-old is in attendance?"
"Like, not wanting children who will cry, throw tantrums or be disruptive makes complete sense."
"Did they seriously expect a high school sophomore to make a scene at the wedding?"
"If you really don't want anyone under 18 at your wedding, I do think you need to be explicit about that."
"As childfree can absolutely be interpreted as 'no small children,' and of course, a teenager who will be an adult in, like, 2.5 years doesn't fall into that category."
"Still, OP 100% should have checked." ~ crystalzelda
"Agree--YTA OP, but really because you didn't ask first (and also because this probably put your daughter in an awkward position)."
"I would also have assumed 'no children' meant no small children but would have double-checked to avoid a situation like this."
"I will say i would definitely find it incredibly weird if my sister didn't want her teenage niece at her wedding, assuming they have a good relationship."
"I feel like there's a difference between banning small kids who couldn't care less about going to a wedding versus banning a teenage girl who wants to be there to see her aunt get married." ~ bonertootz
"YTA...You don't bring anyone who is not invited to a wedding. If you wanted your daughter to attend, you should have asked and discussed beforehand."
"This is your sister after all, right?" ~ RoyallyOakie
"How was this not discussed beforehand."
"My niece got married years ago."
"We knew it was a child-free wedding."
"Our youngest was 13."
"I privately messaged her and asked if he was excluded, and she responded and said no, that her teenage cousins were invited."
"How are you the MOH at your sister's child-free wedding, and the 15-year-old never comes up? ESH." ~ One-Confidence-6858
OP came back with an update...
"Based on the responses, I understand that I was rude for not at least checking in first."
"I should have verified whether or not my daughter could come."
"There was no malicious intent, but all the same, I will apologize to my sister and daughter."
"My sister and daughter are very close, another reason why I thought she would have been invited."
"I have seen these questions a lot so: The invite was a pretty generic card that said 'We hope to see you at our wedding!' with the RSVP info, dresscode, etc."
"I RSVP'd two people, my daughter and I."
"I believe my sister thought the two RSVPs were my husband and I."
"My husband did not attend as he was suddenly called out of town for a work conference."
"There was a place setting, chair, etc, for my daughter because I RSVP'd two people."
"I assumed my daughter would be allowed because my sister stated that she didn't want children at the wedding due to noise, tantrums, misbehavior, etc."
"I apologized to my sister and daughter; we are all doing well relationship-wise."
"Thank you for your insight!"
OP, Reddit definitely had some issues with your choices.
Not your wedding, not your decisions.
But it sounds like you listened, and this will be settled peacefully.
Good luck.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp