No matter how happy they are, most relationships are a little bit messy.
But things are especially messy when someone has an affair, cringed the "Am I the A**hole?" (AITA) subReddit.
Redditor Alone_Sherbert_3607 had been terribly hurt when his wife cheated on him and became pregnant with another man's baby.
But when she demanded that he help her support the new baby, the Original Poster (OP) wondered if he was selfish to not want to.
He asked the sub:
"AITA for telling my kids why I don't buy their half-sibling anything?"
The OP was hurt when his wife cheated on him.
"The mother of my two children (10 Male and 9 Female) cheated on me during our marriage and became pregnant with another man's child."
"I learned this when I caught her with the man in question and after quizzing her, she admitted there was a strong chance he was the father of the baby she was pregnant with."
"I ended our marriage right there and took a DNA test when her youngest was born and she was not mine."
But the OP was committed to caring for his two children.
"So in the divorce custody and support, only our two kids were factored in."
"I paid some child support because I made more than her but we had 50-50 custody time with the kids and I remained an involved dad."
"My ex lived with her youngest's father in October of last year when he took off without a word and dipped from their lives."
"She has been in pursuit of child support ever since but he cannot be found and he quit the last known job he had, so she has been unsuccessful so far."
"This has led to her struggling and I buy more for the kids we share so they don't suffer because of the failed relationship with the affair partner."
The OP did not feel comfortable assisting with the other child.
"Last month my ex told me she was struggling to keep up with the expenses for her youngest and she asked me if I would maybe buy some stuff that included her too."
"I said no, that I was responsible for my kids and I would not become financially responsible in any way for the child she made while cheating on me."
"She begged and told me they will have different lives if I don't help at least for now and I told her that was not my problem and maybe she'll think about that in the future before she starts an ongoing affair."
"She told our kids about asking me and encouraged them to ask me for them."
"The kids were confused because they have always known their half-sister is not my child, but they started to doubt because of how their mom talked (saying good men take care of all their children and loving a child who is part of your family should never be that hard)."
The OP decided to be honest with his children.
"The kids approached me and asked me about it and told me their mom wanted them to ask me for stuff for their half-sister."
"So I explained to them that she is not my child or part of my family but she is still part of theirs."
"They asked why since my oldest has some memories of his mom and I being together while she was pregnant."
"I said their mom got pregnant with their half-sister while we were together but DNA proved she was not mine and I did not raise her for that reason. I told them I am still their dad and nothing has changed but I was never really their half-sister's dad and don't want to buy her stuff like I do for them."
"They understood and when they went back to their mom's she called and cussed me out for telling the kids more details than she wanted them to know."
"I said they had always been aware they had a different dad to her other child and that needed to remain clear because I was not claiming her now that her father has abandoned her."
"She called me a cruel d**k."
"AITA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
- NTA: Not the A**hole
- YTA: You're the A**hole
- ESH: Everybody Sucks Here
- NAH: No A**holes Here
Some urged the OP to be mindful of parental alienation and to reconsider custody.
"You could possibly argue parental alienation with how she is using the kids to try and get you to pay more and making you seem to be the bad guy." - igwbuffalo
"You should still keep the idea of custody amendment in your back pocket. if she already can't afford shoes and school supplies when the kid is only five, it's only going to get worse in the future."
"And you'll want to keep an eye and ear out to make sure she doesn't take your kid's stuff to give to her other kid, or dip into the child support she's supposed to use on your kids for the other kid."
"And if you still have friends and family in common that you both see, you'll want to make sure she doesn't try to turn them against you."
"Not saying any of this will happen, but we see a lot of stuff like this here on Reddit. Another thing I remember seeing here, someone in a similar situation to you, their ex-partner started telling the affair kid to call the ex 'dad' when their affair partner left." - MageVicky
"NTA. You're not obligated to financially support your kids' half-sister, and it doesn't sound like your explanation encouraged a divide between them or similar; if your ex didn't want them to have more information about the situation at hand, she shouldn't have tried to use them to manipulate you." - author124
"This is a terrible situation for kids. They shouldn't be involved in any issues between their parents."
"So you're stuck either looking like the bad guy for not telling them why you are treating their sibling differently, or you have to buy into the dynamic of telling your children information that isn't any of their business at ages nine and ten."
"NTA for not wanting to support a child that isn't yours. And NTA for telling your kids (the hopefully age-appropriate) truth." - tinyd71
"I think you need to bring it up every time she complains about money or asks you for more support."
"Repeatedly saying, 'I won't give you money but I can take my kids more to relieve your financial stress,' will eventually get through to her. Either she'll stop asking or she'll agree."
"Just be careful she doesn't get to a point of taking your kids stuff off them to share it with her youngest or even selling it." - chaserscarlet
Others encouraged the OP to help if he felt able.
"NTA. Your ex tried to make you out to be the bad guy and force your hand, banking on you not wanting to involve the kids. That was super wrong of her and good on you for not taking it. Stand your ground there."
"That being said, when she says she can't afford stuff for the youngest kid, are we talking fun things like toys or basic necessities like diapers?"
"Obviously, you are neither responsible for the youngest kid nor are you the a**hole for refusing to engage. Your ex made her mess."
"But if it's the latter and you can afford it, I would consider buying her occasional basic necessities if you get the feeling that she genuinely cannot afford them (not just giving her money). Ultimately, the kid would be the one suffering and she is innocent in all of that."
"I would use it to show to your kids the importance of being compassionate, even to strangers you have no responsibility towards (and stress that!)." - MrsPomMummy
"OP, NTA but for the above reason, you should go above and beyond to spare your kids from broken interpersonal dynamics."
"Stress that it's not their halfsibling's fault and you don't dislike them, you're just not their father; that they should love them as a family because they are family; and that they shouldn't get angry at their mother because of her betrayal, since that's between you two, and that if she ever tells them things like 'you not loving your kids,' they should never be afraid to ask you about it so you can clear things up."
"Your kids could easily start hating their sibling, lose their mother, and simultaneously become susceptible to her manipulations in short order. You need a balance of mitigating strategies for all three issues and some visibility on the bulls**t she feeds them." - PharmBoyStrength
"Well, NTA. I'm strongly against talking badly about the other parent to shared kids (no matter how justified), but here it was your ex who muddled the waters and clarification was needed."
"I do feel sorry for the youngest kid though, not her fault that your ex cheated or her father left, but she's going to pay for it. Still, clearly not your responsibility." - sephyir
"NTA. What your ex did by talking to the kids about support likely violated your court order. It's specifically spelled out in mine that neither parent is to talk to the kids about parenting time or money."
"As a single mom to three whose ex has also completely dipped due to his refusal to treat his own mental health problems, I can sympathize with her struggle, but she crossed a line that she shouldn't have."
"She'll probably never get child support for her youngest or it will be really rare and sporadic. It's her responsibility to come up with solutions to that, not yours. How she runs her household is none of your business as long as your kids are fed, clothed, and have adequate shelter."
"If she decides to allocate resources unfairly between your kids and their halfsibling, then that's her doing. A disproportionate amount of her own funds should go to supporting the youngest and that's just a fact of life." - Alternative_Fox_7637
"No. The mother of the child has her own family. Let her ask the grandparents or aunts and uncles to help out. How can she not afford shoes when you can get kids' shoes at Goodwill for a couple of bucks."
"The mother needs to get humble and figure out how to be a single mom. No way OP should clean up her mess by jerking the heartstrings about the poor child. A good mother goes without to make sure her child is taken care of."
"If OP bails her out now, he'll be stuck for life." - Square_Band9870
While the subReddit could empathize with the young children who was the result of an affair, they also encouraged the op to lead his own life and to keep his relationship with his two children strong.
It might be nice to help a child in need, but when he already had two children who needed him, the OP might only get himself in trouble if he were to start helping now.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp