Getting finances consolidated in anticipation of or after marriage is something most couples should do. Eliminating duplicate subscriptions to services like streaming or deliveries can end up saving a couple thousands of dollars.
A newlywed turned to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit for feedback after one such consolidation caused family friction.
Toasted_Lizard asked:
"AITA for removing my sister-in-law from the family Spotify plan?"
The original poster (OP) explained:
"I got married a couple weeks ago, and we're in the process of merging our finances. This includes going through all of our subscriptions to reduce redundancy and sync our bills."
"In doing so, we realized that my husband's brother's ex wife is still on his Family Spotify Plan. Because she is, we can't add me."
"My husband started the family plan about six years ago for himself and his two older brothers. It allows him to have four separate accounts in the plan, and the cost per account is lower than paying for them individually."
"When the plan was created, each brother got an account and the last account went to the middle brother's wife. The plan is under my husband's name, so he is the administrator."
"He gets billed annually and the others reimburse him for their share."
"At the time, this made perfect sense."
"They all saved some money, the middle brother was the only one with a spouse, and although my husband and I had been together for about a year at the time, I was about to start grad school so I could still get the student pricing and thus had no reason to join the plan."
"Now, it makes less sense. I'm out of school, we're married, and the middle brother got divorced about a year and a half ago."
"We can easily afford to keep my separate Spotify, but we also realized the ex never paid my husband back when the plan renewed this year, so we agreed it made more sense to remove her and add me in order to simplify our subscriptions."
"So that's exactly what my husband did. He deactivated her, joined my Spotify to the plan, and texted his middle brother to let the ex know."
"We didn't text her directly because she became extremely volatile during their divorce so the brother asked our whole family not to contact her directly so all communication could flow through a specific moderated messaging app that their lawyers recommended."
"This has caused a family conflict. The middle brother is mad at us because he feels like we're forcing him to have another fight with his ex just so we could save a buck. It's true that she will definitely be set off by this."
"Plus, he feels like she 'deserves' to stay on the plan because they were together for a long time (aka, longer than my husband and I). We can definitely see how it sucks for him to have to reach out to his ex, and inevitably piss her off."
"On the other hand, the oldest brother agrees with us."
"She can't stay on their family plan forever just to avoid a conflict, it's healthier to sever these last ties, she chose to leave the family (divorce was her call) so she gave up any family-related benefits, and there are logical reasons for me to join the plan now."
"So, internet strangers, AITA for asking to join my husbands family Spotify plan, and thereby forcing his brother to have a conflict with his ex?"
The OP later added:
"Now, to be fair, there was never an expectation that we would continue to pay for her. That was just an oversight this year."
"The middle brother offered to keep paying for her share of the plan."
"We discussed that idea, but my husband and the other brother wanted her off the plan either way. They told the middle brother he could offer to pay for her new account if it was that big a deal."
"We didn't ask him to call her. We just let him know we were removing her."
"I just included the detail that we told him only to explain why we didn't let her know ourselves. He could decide not to tell her, or to reach out."
"We don't really care. He's the one who feels obligated to reach out to her."
"My husband sees it as 'his' plan because it's in his name (and thus no discussion needed) while his brother sees it as 'theirs' because they all pay equally (and thus we should have consulted him first). I can see it both ways."
"It was being split 4 ways, until last year when she didn't pay for hers. She may have just forgotten, we sure did."
"The issue with closing the plan completely is that the two brothers would lose their saved playlists, etc... because their accounts only exist under the umbrella of the plan."
"I don't care about mine, but to them that's a no-go. It was more about the simplicity and severing ties than about the nominal savings."
"If there's a way to sever them without totally losing their accounts, we haven't been able to figure it out. This was one of the possible solutions proposed by the oldest brother."
"As far as we can tell, we would have to close the family plan, and then the two brothers (and I, but my account is brand-new anyways so it doesn't matter) would need to create totally new accounts."
"We do know she uses it because we can see her audiobook purchases in the plan history, and just based on past experiences it's a safe bet that she will be displeased."
The OP summed up their situation.
"My husband and I decided to remove his brother's ex wife from the family Spotify plan, so that he could add me instead."
"This could make me the a**hole because the ex will be pissed off, and this will create a conflict between her and my husband's brother."
Redditors weighed in by declaring:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors decided the OP was not the a**hole (NTA).
"So let me get this straight. You and your husband are paying for this subscription and yet you're the bad guy?"
"That is one screwed up family that you have married into. The only people that you two should be paying for are both of you. If they're going to be this upset you need to cut everyone else off and make them pay for their own subscriptions and you two do you."
"Talk about entitlement. I cannot believe that they are putting an ex-wife over an official family member. Oh hell no. You need to stand your ground on this. You are absolutely in the right on this."
"I respect you for clarifying that the middle brother would reimburse for his ex-wife, but the fact still remains that this is your husband's plan and how dare everyone yell at you and come at you when you're the ones that are ultimately responsible for the plan itself."
"You are not being treated with the respect you deserve. Make his brother and his ex-wife get their own plan. I'm sure once you suggest this, he might actually get how ridiculous this is." ~ StormWilling5279
"NTA, but you're only hearing the brother's side of the story. It is possible that the ex would be less upset if people just communicated with her directly like an adult instead of playing games."
"If the ex is going to be upset no matter who contacts her, someone is going to have to take it on the chin. It makes sense for your husband to be the one to tell her, seeing as how he's newly married and reorganizing his finances."
"There is no reason to poke the bear by telling her, 'we're taking you off so that we can put someone else on'. Just tell her you're closing the account altogether due to no one else paying."
"Your original question was AITA. People get upset when they are left in the dark and feel powerless."
"It is avoidant to cross your fingers and hope that she has already stopped using the account, and to hope that she won't notice that it's gone. It is avoidant to pretend that she will be easier to manage if no one tells her the account was closed and she just finds out the next time she tries to use the account."
"There is no good reason to be avoidant on this issue. Just treat her with enough respect to let her know what's going on."
"Even if she pushes back and complains, you don't have to engage with any of that, you can just say 'we have to put our finances in order. I understand that it's inconvenient for you, but our decision has been made'." ~ 4E4ME
"I don't think it is necessary that middle brother lets her know. She is bound to notice the next time she tries to use Spotify."
"She will either just accept that she is not part of that family anymore (by her own choice), or will reach out from her side to b*tch about it, in which case middle brother has the same fight as he is fearing for when he reaches out to let her know."
"And if she complains about it, the answer to 'Why did you remove me?' should simply be 'You didn't pay for it at the last renewal, so we assumed you don't want to be on it anymore'." ~ Future-Crazy-CatLady
Severing this tie seems like the best idea for everyone, even if the one brother needs to communicate with his ex-wife over it.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp