Many families look forward to the holidays when they can reunite and get together. One element of spending the holidays with family that not everyone looks forward to, however, is hosting.
That places the burden of making sure everyone has food and shelter for the duration of their stay on one person.
Luckily, some people relish hosting large gatherings of people.
Others will look for every possible way to get out of it.
The family of Redditor BonusSpecialist1607 had a system that ensured hosting during the holidays never constantly fell on one individual.
Unfortunately, one of the original poster (OP)'s daughters always found a way out of hosting when it was technically her turn.
Having decided that she canceled on her family one too many times, the OP felt there was only one fair consequence for their daughter to face.
Fearing they may have gone too far, the OP took to the subReddit "Am I The A**hole" (AITA), where they asked fellow Redditors:
"AITA for disinviintg my daughter to Thanksgiving when she won't host Thanksgiving?"
The OP explained why their daughter did not receive an invite to their house this Thanksgiving:
"In our family, holidays are rotated, so one person hosts the Fourth of July, another hosts Christmas, and another hosts Thanksgiving etc.."
"This way, no one is constantly hosting, and it makes it fair for everyone."
"This post is about my middle daughter, Clara."
"Clara has always been skipping her host duties, when it gets to her she has an excuse why she can't host."
"It ranges but usually goes along the lines of stress or she is too busy."
"This results in other family members to pick up her holiday."
"It is frustrating and multiple people have talked to her about this."
"She bailed on hosting Easter but promised me that she would do Thanksgiving."
"We swapped holidays."
"At the time, I made it very clear she needed to stay true to her word, and if she dumped it on someone else, she wouldn't be going to Thanksgiving."
"It usually gets dumped on me."
"Anyway, I called her asking if she wanted me to bring a dessert board for Thanksgiving."
"She told me that she could not host because she had just moved into her home (she moved in July), and it was too messy to host."
"I told her she could clean since it was a few weeks away."
"She told me she can't."
"I know the other kids can't host it (well, one could, but she is doing Christmas, and it's not fair at all for her)."
"I informed everyone it would be at my place this year."
"I also informed everyone that Clara is not invited this year to Thanksgiving."
"Clara was pissed when I told her that, and we got into a huge argument."
"She thinks I am a big jerk."
"My other kids are split; two of them are happy since they are tired of picking up her slack when this happens, while others think this is too far."
"So outside opinion."
"AITA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in on where they believed the OP fell in this particular situation, by declaring:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
- NAH – No A**holes Here
While the Reddit community was somewhat divided, they largely agreed that the OP was not the a**hole for disinviting Clara from Thanksgiving.
Many felt the OP's decision was more than justified, agreeing that if Clara didn't want to host, she shouldn't have bailed at the last minute and spoken up earlier.
"NTA."
"Because Thanksgiving is three weeks away, and if the OP didn't ask about what to bring, there was no indication that the daughter was going to say," I can't host. "So she really was about to mess up everyone's holiday plans."
"if you dont want to host say that, i cannot host thats not my thing."
"I can be in charge of bring xyz to all family functions to make up for it. but to take on the responsibility and then flake every time is bs."- jsbleez
"The title made me think you'd be the AH, but after hearing she asked to swap and then pulled out at the last minute it completely changed my mind."
"Clara is an AH for constantly promising to do something and then pulling out at the last minute."
"Hosting is exhausting and it usually costs you in both money and time."
"It's fair enough that some people don't enjoy it. However, you can't continue to reap the benefits from everyone else whilst giving nothing in return and expect to keep being invited."
"If she knows she doesn't want to host and never will, she should be upfront and offer to cover costs and help set up/ clean up someone else's place."
"Or have her year at a venue (even a park), so then no one is in her house."
"NTA."- chaserscarlet
"What is the REAL reason she doesn't host?"
"Does she suck at cooking?"
"Does she have severe anxiety?"
"Is she struggling financially?"
"If she's just lazy, then NTA."
"But if you've never asked, time you should."
"I know someone who would get SO stressed hosting dinners (the house had to be perfect, as did the food). Her husband put his foot down."
"It was too hard on her, so they would take their turn but pay for everyone to eat at a restaurant."- Annual_Version_6250
"NTA."
"Tell the ones that have a problem with it to pick up her slack next time and see how supportive they are then."- Just_Papaya_6669
"NTA."
"She thought you were bluffing."
"You can offer to let her pay for all the food, your time, and a house cleaner, or she can't come."
"She used to cheaping out- it's time she grew up."- KiriYogi
Others felt that the OP was far too harsh in disinviting Clara, feeling that it wasn't fair for anyone to be forced to host a holiday or gathering:
"I'm really struggling to make a judgment here because I think the concept of 'everyone HAS to host one large gathering' is kind of odd to me."
"My sister hates hosting people in her space, and I'd never want to make her do it just because it's what is seen as fair."
"On the other hand, my brother and sister-in-law love hosting people and parties at their house."
"They usually do Christmas, Halloween, Easter, and have everyone over."
"I usually do Thanksgiving and New Year, and our parents will usually do like 4th of July, Labor and Memorial Day (they have a pool)."
"It just kind of worked out that everyone picked holidays that play to their strengths, and my sister has been to every single event and will always offer to help set up/clean/bring things in lieu of official host duties."
"I couldn't imagine forcing her to take on duties that she hates and make her miserable or tell her not to come to our parties because I love her."
"Sure, I get stressed hosting too, but I'd rather have my sister to celebrate with then alienate her and still have to pick up slack."
"I think I'm leaning towards YTA because I don't think this should be such a forced procedure."-_ChloeSilverado_
"YTA."
"Why would you force someone to host who absolutely doesn't feel comfortable doing it?"
"It should be a thing to rotate between family members who actually want to host."
"Cutting her out of the holiday because she doesn't want to do things your way makes you a massively entitled a**hole."
"Thanks for calling."- bainjuice
Then there were those who had trouble sympathizing with either the OP or Clara, feeling it was unreasonable to force someone to host, but Clara also should have spoken up earlier than she did.
"ESH."
"Did Clara actually agree to being part of the rotation?"
"She clearly doesn't want to host family events, and there's nothing wrong with that."
"I wouldn't want a bunch of people in my space either!"
"It's a weird hill to die on to completely disinvite your daughter from a holiday about spending time with family."
"I feel like you're being spiteful because she's not conforming to exactly what you want her to do."
"That being said, Clara needs to set firm boundaries and make it known she is not hosting events rather than agreeing to do so and pawning it off on someone else at the last minute."- lrnjrsh
A hosting rotation is a fair solution, in theory.
However, when someone finds no joy in hosting, it likely won't result in a pleasant experience for the host or the guests.
Seeing as Clara has proven herself to be anything but a natural host, perhaps the OP might want to go back to the drawing board with her family, and come up with a happier solution that pleases everyone.
Perhaps Clara can learn to speak up and not constantly cause a last-minute change of plans for her entire family.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp