Considering all the drama we hear about weddings, the impulse to just elope is very strong.
But heading off to get married in secret brings its own issues.
Family members may resent not getting to attend.
A sister dealing with her parents' reaction to her brother's elopement turned to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit for feedback.
Icy-Lingonberry-8128 asked:
"AITA for banning my parents from a family event because they don't like my brother's wife?"
The original poster (OP) explained:
"So my little brother is 23. I (30, female) have another brother that's 20, but this is about the 23-year-old who I will call Blake."
"About five months ago, Blake eloped with his girlfriend Shay (19, female). Our parents and my three sisters—Mary (22), Bea (27), and Sarah (25)—were LIVID. Like unusually angry."
"I was a little confused, but I spoke to him, and to me, it seemed like he and his girlfriend loved each other very much and just made the rash decision to elope in Las Vegas. We live about 3 hours from Vegas, so it's a popular day trip destination."
"They were there for the day and eloped. Blake and Shay didn't even tell anyone about their marriage until two months later. They've been together for a year."
"I met her like twice while they were dating, but that's my fault, not theirs. I was a pregnant troll cooped up in my house, refusing to see anyone or go out because I thought I was fat and ugly."
"Like, yeah, it was a little silly, but I don't understand why they're all so angry about it. As far as I know, it's only about the elopement. My parents and my brother haven't mentioned anything else."
"I've tried to have a conversation with my parents about why they hate Shay so much. Nothing of value has resulted."
"I'm starting to think it's a control thing, to be honest. They probably envisioned a big, beautiful wedding for their first son and were shown pictures of a Vegas elopement instead."
"Blake has always been a little bit of a wild child, but I guess an elopement shocked them."
"Blake and Shay are a very wholesome and, dare I say, perfect couple. They very obviously love each other, live together, split the bills, both study for very good degrees, and have two cats."
"They're so adorable! My husband and I are doing amazing, but I'm secretly jealous of how cute my brother and Shay are together."
"In our culture, there's an old saying that couples are one soul split into two, and then they find each other later on. I've never believed it, and no one does, really, but Shay and Blake are convincing me."
"Shay is a different race than us but the same religion. But my sister Mary's boyfriend is the same race as Shay and they love him."
"They even loved Shay before all of this. Heck, my husband is an immigrant, and they adore him."
"My brother does have a lot of inheritance and trust funds waiting for him, but so does Shay. Shay's family are pretty prominent in our town."
"I didn't know her well before they eloped, but I helped her with the applications to take my brother's surname. I saw her well-known maiden name and was pretty stunned for a few hours."
"I've always said you can't put a timeline on life. If they wanna do marriage earlier than usually, who cares?"
"Shay and my brother have been married for 5-ish months now, so if she was pregnant it would be very obvious by now. I really think it's a control thing for my parents."
"I know I'm biased, but I think she's great, and I've never had even the tiniest issue with her. I don't know why they're so mad about it."
"They've made comments about her family—who aren't even bad. Her parents are just divorced. But they don't even know them that well, so I'm not sure."
"My parents have made a point not to invite Shay to any family events since. They'll call up Blake and say 'don't bring your girlfriend'—they refuse to acknowledge the marriage."
"My husband—who is always the troublemaker—suggested Blake make a certified copy of the marriage certificate, laminate it, and send it to our parents. My brother thought it was a great idea, but he never did it. I'm going to bring it up to him again."
"Blake came the first two times they did this but left very early. He's always politely declined all invitations since then."
"I've tried to tell my parents that they are pushing Blake away and soon they can expect to never hear from him again, but they don't seem to care. They take every opportunity to insult Shay even though they used to love her before the elopement."
"It's my son's birthday soon, and I'm planning a big party."
"I sent the guest list in a family group chat and my parents saw that Shay was invited. They demanded that she be taken off, but I refused."
"I regularly tell my parents off for treating them like this and I've skipped out on most family events that Blake has skipped. This is the first time I've hosted anything during this situation, though."
"They were acting in a way that made me suspect they were going to make a scene there, so I banned them. I don't want them to isolate my younger brother."
"He hasn't been to any family events since he got married besides the two when he left early."
"They are infuriated. They are threatening to show up anyway and think I have no right to ban them for someone 'who isn't part of the family.'"
"My mother-in-law has graciously agreed to let us host it at hers, and as far as I know, my parents don't know her address. At least, I hope so—she moved recently, so I'd be concerned about their motives if they knew her new address."
"My sisters and youngest brother think I am overreacting. I could have instead warned them to behave and told them they would be removed if they couldn't."
"They think the ban is nuclear. My parents are demanding an invite and an apology."
"I currently am the only one with kids, so my parents would be pretty upset if I banned them from seeing their only grandkids. My brother definitely appreciates my support in his own way."
"He's usually very quiet and not that expressive—besides when he's with Shay—and he randomly texted me the other day that he wishes he invited me to the elopement. It was very touching."
"AITA?"
The OP summed up their situation.
"I may be an a**hole for banning my parents from my son's birthday."
"This is because they are his grandparents, and banning is a nuclear option."
Redditors weighed in by declaring:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- NAH - No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors unanimously declared the OP was not the a**hole (NTA).
"NTA...your parents didn't get the memo that children grow up. They deserve to be banned, and they should stay banned until THEY apologize and learn how to behave."
"It's easy for your other siblings to say you've overreacted because it's not their situation. I'm sure your brother will appreciate the support." ~ RoyallyOakie
"An invite and an apology? When Hell freezes over."
"Shay has done nothing wrong, and your brother is happy. NTA." ~ Simple-Status-15
"I'm also confused why they're blaming Shay for this. They both got married. It's not as though Blake was dragged to Vegas and forced to marry her. Especially considering you mentioned the family loved her before all this."
"I'd send a message in the group chat saying, 'It's interesting that you think you deserve an invite and an apology of all things, considering the hypocrisy of penalizing Shay for a joint decision between her AND Blake to get married.'"
"'If anyone is owed an apology, it's Shay and Blake for the abysmal way you've treated them for daring to do something that makes them happy. If you're that angry about it, maybe you need to rethink your priorities, because the only ones causing all this drama is you and I'm not about to allow you to make my sons birthday about you and your petty, and frankly ridiculous, grudge'."
"Then I'd watch it all implode, but that's just me. NTA." ~ DiamondKitsune
"NTA. You're absolutely doing the right thing. In the simplest of strokes, I was just like Shay. My husband froze out his parents for 2 years until they realized he wasn't f*cking around and I was his family as far as he was concerned."
"None of his siblings supported him. I found out literally 16 years later it was because his parents had told lies about me—and they were very angry with them for manipulating them and making them miss out on that time with their brother."
"His parents love me now, and I love them, but it was incredibly hard, and had my husband been a lesser man, that would have been a bridge that remained burned."
"Your support means the world to him, especially since I can tell you for a fact he feels like he's alone and it's him and Shay vs the world. Don't buckle." ~ not_doing_that
Hopefully the OP's parents at least learn how to be cordial to their new daughter-in-law.
If not, it's their loss.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp