Wedding invites should be easy.
The couple picks all the people they want there, and everyone accepts it.
But this is so often not the case.
So was it a couple to do then?
Case in point...
Redditor AdNarrow8211 wanted to discuss her experience and get some feedback. So naturally, the bride came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
She asked:
"AITA for telling my sister to stop trying to make my wedding all about her?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"Background: my sister has a black boyfriend, and my parents are not happy about it."
"They've told her if she wants to come to my wedding (which they are paying for) she can't bring her boyfriend."
"She's very upset, particularly since they let my other sister bring her Chinese husband."
"They weren't happy with that either, but say that, 'fundamentally, the Chinese aren't black.'"
"So she's telling me I should cancel the wedding in protest of the 'racism' and marry in a courthouse instead."
"I told her no, and she called me a 'racist by proxy.'"
'I agree she's right to be mad at my parents, but that's not a reason for me to have to marry in a courthouse."
"I told her the wedding is about me and my soon-to-be husband, not her feud with our parents."
"So AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP WAS the a**hole.
"Why are you putting 'racism' in quotes? It is racism. Don't downplay it."
"I get wanting the wedding to be about you and wanting her to put her feelings aside."
"But she isn't wrong that your wedding will be a racist wedding, paid for by racist parents, and you will be racists by proxy because your wedding will be 'racists welcome, black people must stay outside.'"
"Enjoy your wedding. Forgot to say YTA." ~ pnandgillybean
"Hell yeah, it's a racist wedding."
"OP, you're right about one thing— you're not a racist by proxy— you're just a regular racist."
"If you think it's wrong to exclude someone because they are black, but you're willing to turn a blind eye for the price of floral arrangements, catering, and some cake, then the only difference between you and your parents is your morals and ethics have a price tag."
"At least they're racist for free. YTA." ~ Om_Chianti
"If you really want to put your money where your mouth is, tell your parents that if they're paying for control of the guest list, they can keep their money and you will invite whomever you want to your wedding."
"Invite your sisters and their partners and let your parents decide for themselves if they want to be there and if this is truly a hill on which they're willing to die."
"This is only the beginning."
"How do you think they will treat their racially mixed grandchildren?"
"Will you put up with the likely favoritism?" ~ oylaura
"This is about more than money."
"It's about watching her kids wonder why their cousins are treated differently."
"How does OP explain this?"
"That they benefit from racism says a lot about OP, if she lets this happen."
"I'm one of four adopted grandchildren, out of eight."
"When our grandmother was dying, two of us went to see her."
"Both of us were adopted; the rest couldn't or wouldn't."
"Yet it was very important to our Grandma that a certain item be left to one of my cousins because she's 'blood.'"
"And yes, when she specified that, I forced her to tell me why."
"I'm happy to say that I wasn't thinking fast enough to ask her where her 'blood' relatives were right then."
"We were also the only two to go to her funeral."
"My point is, the children will know, they will notice, and they won't forget." ~ oylaura
"I can't remember what words he used, but one of my best friends is on the spectrum and used a very racist word for Asian people."
I just looked at him, told him to look at me (I used to do this when I was being serious about something, it helped him understand it) and told him to never ever use that word again, that it was racist, and then explain why when he asked."
"So you do have some people who just use a word not knowing that it's racist, but that's very very rare." ~ GearsOfWar2333
"Jumping on this comment because it says it perfectly."
"OP you're YTA."
"If you want to go some way to start to redeem yourself, have your wedding but ban your parents."
"If I was your sister I'd tell you to shove your self-indulgent wedding and want nothing to do with you or your parents." ~ Floofieunderpants
"I agree. What bothers me too, and makes me call OP a racist not just by proxy, is that OP is fine with it all."
"If it's her wedding, why is she not telling her parents that it's not their place to decide the guest list?"
"She's clearly fine with her sister's boyfriend being discriminated against and him not being invited to the wedding."
"OP, you are racist."
"YTA. So are your parents." ~ 2tinymonkeys
"Soon as I saw her put racist in scare quotes I knew OP was a racist."
"Literally the only people who do that are deeply racist people."
"OP, you are racist, your parents are racist, your wedding is racist, and your lucky your B[rother] I[n] L[aw] will even be in your presence considering you think 'at least Chinese isn't black' and cannot see how unbelievably f**ked up that sentence is."
"And yes, YTA."
"I hope your sisters cut you and your parents off because, and I cannot stress this enough, you are all incredibly racist people." ~ Seliphra
"And your sister doesn't have a feud with your parents, your parents have a racist problem with her boyfriend."
"Why aren't you telling your parents to behave, instead of expecting your sister to put up and shut up."
"If you really believe in what you're doing, you should be prepared to explain to each and every guest exactly why your sister hasn't attended. YTA." ~ MichaSound
"OP should not have to do a courthouse wedding."
"However what OP should have to do is find a way to pay for the wedding she wants without letting racists control it."
"If having her dream wedding paid for is more important than her sister's boyfriend and the racism they are suffering, OP absolutely is racist." ~ ladancer22
"YTA. Stand up to your racist parents and find a different way to pay for your wedding that doesn't enable their truly morally reprehensible behavior."
"If you go through with your wedding under your parents' conditions, you are racist by proxy."
"'Don't be racist,' is a really, really baseline standard to hold yourself to."
"I believe in you. It's not too late to do the right thing." ~ prple_ppl_eater
"OP and their parents are racists."
"If you are A-OK with segregation and racism for financial gain, then you fully support racism."
"Full stop."
"I hope that OP has the wedding that they deserve and their racist views fully come to light in their entire social circle."
"Let all of their guests know the kind of wedding that they are supporting so they have the option to not to attend if they don't support racially segregated gatherings."
"I'm an educated, intelligent, successful, and most of all, happy black woman."
"OP and her parents may hate my existence, but it doesn't matter."
"Their racist opinions do not negate that I am here and they are not superior to me in ANY way."
"Go ahead and enjoy your racist wedding as you and your parents put your racist views on full public display." ~ Electrical-Date-3951
"YTA, for being racist."
"Because that's what you are when you allow your parents to act the way they are and still associate with them, and even let them pay for your wedding."
"I don't get how you and both of your sisters are still willing to have contact with your parents if they are so blatantly racist." ~ nicehatonyourhead
"YTA. Your sister is not making this about her…Your parents are racist, and you're allowing their racism by letting them control your guest list."
"It's your right to take your parent's money for your wedding."
"But in doing so, you're responsible for the consequences of it."
"If I was your sister I wouldn't want to be involved with any of you." ~ ArchieS0121
"YTA. Quit letting your parents buy off your complacency."
"My sister died 12 years ago."
"Even on her literal deathbed, doped up on more morphine than you can imagine, she was insisting that anyone coming to visit be accepting of my husband and our daughter, neither of whom is white."
"One of the last moments I had with her, she was kicking our very racist grandmother out, because she had said something awful about my daughter."
"She protected me and fought for me while she was dying." ~ Aggravating_Secret_7
"Huge YTA. WTF?"
"Using your parents' funding as an excuse further reiterates your blatant racism."
"Your poor sister... dealing with such a selfish, shi**y, racist family." ~ lbandrew
Well OP, Reddit has some issues with your situation.
It may be time to take a long, hard look at this.
Some family counseling sounds in order.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp