All brides sparkle on their wedding days.
Some brides know what their dress will look like when they are five.
Others search and search through exhaustion to find that perfect fit.
So, telling a bride her dress is inadequate may not always go over well.
Redditor This-Rock-4028 wanted to discuss their experience and get some feedback. So naturally, they came to visit the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subReddit.
They asked:
"AITA for Warning My Brother's Fiancé Her Wedding Dress Might Cause Problems?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"My brother is getting married soon, and his fiancée chose a very revealing wedding dress."
"It's low-cut, with a thigh-high slit and a sheer back."
"I'm all for people wearing what they want, but our family is quite conservative and opinionated, and I know this dress will cause a lot of drama, especially with our grandparents (talking people walking out on the wedding kind of drama)."
"At a family dinner, I pulled her aside and gently suggested she might want to reconsider her choice, explaining the likely reactions from our older relatives."
"I made sure to clarify that I absolutely respect it's her choice and her special day but wanted to at least warn her of what could happen."
"She got very upset and said it's her wedding and she'll wear whatever she wants."
"My brother is now mad at me, accusing me of trying to control their wedding."
"Some of my family members think I was just looking out for her, while others say I overstepped."
The OP was left to wonder:
"AITA for telling my brother's fiancée her wedding dress might be inappropriate for our conservative family?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP WAS the A**hole.
"Why is your first inclination to tell her to find a different dress instead of telling her you have her back in case anything comes up?"
"Or better yet, just not telling her anything because that's a surefire way to make her feel SUPER insecure about her body during her wedding."
"YTA, Seems like the only drama that's happening is because of you making a problem where there wasn't one." ~ OkInflation6174
"Gentle YTA."
"The time to mention it would have been before she went shopping."
"And even then, remember that it's just your guess that your grandparents will embarrass themselves by huffing out in front of everyone because of a dress."
"If she already picked out the dress, she's likely both emotionally and financially quite invested in it."
"This is not something she can easily change."
"It does sound a bit controlling to come to her now- after she's found the dress she loves- and to tell her she made the wrong choice." ~ HowlPen
"The groom should have discussed it with her before the shopping."
"I absolutely agree that now that the dress has been purchased, it's more complicated, but if the family is likely to react as dramatically as OP suspects, the bride absolutely should have that information (and the sooner the better)."
"I think that the groom is the a**hole here."
"Even if he doesn't care about his family s**t-talking his bride/wife, she should know that it's a plausible outcome."
"If I picked out a dress that I loved, that my groom okay'd (either having seen it or by description), and his grandparents left the wedding out of disgust/aunts and uncles spent the whole wedding looking at me like a harlot/the family refused to put up wedding photos with those of other siblings/the skankiness of my wedding dress was a point of discussion for years."
"I would be incredibly angry if my partner didn't discuss these possibilities with me because he didn't care."
"The worst time for the bride to find out about this dynamic would be if people leave during the ceremony."
"The second worst is the day of."
"The more time she has to process and react, the better. "
"At the very least, she'll at least be prepared to brush off any bulls**t that comes her way."
"Maybe OP overstepped a little bit, but if this was the first/only time future SIL was hearing about the potential for these reactions I think OP did her a solid." ~ girlyfoodadventures
"Let's be clear who the real a**holes would be in this scenario, and that would be anybody who walks out of a wedding because the bride's dress does not conform to their own ideals." ~ BrinaGu3
"I agree, but I have to admit that I want to see the dress from the OP."
"I would never walk out of a wedding because of the bride's dress, and I'm not at all conservative, but even I have seen some dresses that make me uncomfortable."
"The bride should wear what she wants, but when the top barely covers the nipples, there are going to be reactions." ~ SincerelyCynical
"I think you're missing the point."
"Regardless of whether or not older conservative family members should keep their comments and opinions to themselves and just suck it up and enjoy the wedding, will they?"
"It's not about those family members being right or wrong, we know they're wrong, wrong, wrong."
"However, if the bride knows they will be all judgmental and offended, is she willing to deal with that?"
"Is her husband willing to take her side and deal with his stupid family?"
"All things she should know before the situation escalates."
"No, she shouldn't have to deal with any of that, but that's not the point." ~ magicpenny
"Exactly. And she's marrying into the family, so she needs to be prepared if it's going to be this way because it won't end at the wedding."
"Then she and the groom can choose how to deal with this - he stands up for her or she decides it's not worth battling this the rest of her life."
"Being 'Reddit right' doesn't always translate to the real world."
"She's not marrying Reddit, she's marrying a guy with a very conservative family."
"OP is NTA." ~ random-sh1t
"Agree. I don't think she should have suggested changing dresses but focus just on the warning."
"Like 'Hey your dress is amazing. You're gonna look great!'"
"'I just wanted to let you know our grandparents have been rude/vocal/etc about anything outside their conservative standards.'"
"'Hopefully, they don't do anything at your wedding, but I wanted to let you know so you could at least be on alert/emotionally prepared/not caught off guard in case they do say something.'"
"OP could have then offered to stand up for SIL or made an Additional point to show support for SIL."
"OP could also have shared a story of when grandparents acted out of sorts to back up claims." ~ Dino-chicken-nugg3t
"But we all know that's not how things actually work because you're asking AHs to not be AHs."
"You can tell the people who are AHs that they shouldn't be, but it's unlikely for them to change."
"Warning someone that other people might be AHs because of something they have control over is just preparing them."
"Personally I'd much rather know in advance and have a choice about what I'm going to do rather than be blindsided on the day."
"If that means keeping my dress and telling the groom to sit his extended family in the back row so they can walk out if they want then so be it."
"But really the groom should have explained all of this before she went dress shopping."
"OP didn't tell her she had to change the dress, just to be aware that it might not go down well."
"She wasn't being malicious about it." ~ Perfectly2Imperfect
"I would like to know where OP is from or what cultures are being represented here."
"American wedding culture is very individualistic: Your wedding, your day, the bride is in charge, etc etc. Indian wedding culture is community-oriented: it's about two families meeting and joining, not only about the two individuals."
"In a cross-cultural ceremony, OP would not be the a-hole at all."
"In fact, the brother is the a**hole for not letting his future wife know that her choice of dress could cause problems."
"Many Americans can't seem to understand that weddings aren't all the same and that their conception of an American wedding doesn't mean that everyone has to follow all the same traditions or keep the same priorities."
"I can completely see this being a NTA because it's not about controlling the bride's body, it's also about the comfort of the guests at the wedding." ~ KanishkT123
"YTA. 'Might be inappropriate for our conservative family?' .. if that is the case, the dress is NOT the problem."
"Your AH family is."
"You MASSIVELY overstepped."
"'She got very upset and said it's her wedding and she'll wear whatever she wants.'... this is the only reasonable answer. "
"You can be glad you are still invited."
"And her reaction to you shows she is well capable of handling all the other AHs who cause drama like you did." ~ Excellent-Count4009
"YTA. No one asked your opinion."
"You could have asked if she wanted feedback on her dress or your relatives."
"You could have spoken to your brother about it if there is some reason to believe he is unaware of your family."
"Instead of talking to her, how about talking to your relatives about not also being a**holes?" ~ RutabagaConsistent60
"Here's the thing: OP is the a**hole for being the one who enforces the conservative standards in the guise of being helpful..."
"'I'm all for people wearing what they want, but our family is quite conservative and opinionated, and I know this dress will cause a lot of drama.'"
"The above is a lie."
"If OP was actually all for people wearing what they want, she wouldn't say anything."
"Instead she's taken it upon herself to enforce the conservative standard, and in so doing sets/reinforces those standards.
"F**k OP." ~ WhydIJoinRedditAgain
Well, OP, Reddit understands your plight but questions your actions.
The real villain is clearly the family IF they react the way you say they will.
You may want to reach out and try it with a little more finesse.
And let the happy couple know you have their back.
Good luck.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp