One of the harsh realities of getting older is the likelihood of losing our elderly family members.
We want to spend as much time as humanly possible with them as tomorrow is never a guarantee.
But when logistics come into play, our good intentions can be challenged.
A 32-year-old wife and mother to three children unsuccessfully dealt with such logistics involving her husband and sought the Am I the A**hole (AITA) subReddit for judgment.
Sea_Possibility7242 asked:
"AITA for 'not allowing my husband to visit his dying grandmother'?"
The original poster (OP) explained:
"Not my main, as this is quite personal and I don't want my husband to find it. All names are fake."
"I know the title makes me sound pretty horrible. Before you judge me, please try to understand my point of view."
"My (32 F[female]) husband (34 M[ale]) , let's call him Caleb, has a very close relationship with his grandparents ('Marie' and 'Tom') They raised him and his siblings because his parents were absent."
"Obviously, Caleb sees them as his parental figures and loves them. So do I. They are wonderful, kind people and I will forever be thankful to them for raising my husband so well and treating me with such love."
"Caleb's parents live in Germany, and me and Caleb live in Canada (we moved for my job and better quality of life for our children (3F, 6M, 7F). The flight to visit them is around 9 hours, so visits are rare (once or twice every two years)."
"Unfortunately, in the summer of 2023, Marie (Caleb's mom) got diagnosed with a tumour and started getting very sick."
"We were all devastated and went to spend the whole summer with her in Germany. Her condition remained stable-ish for the whole time and we were hopeful we would have many more years with her."
"In October, she had a heart attack and was hospitalized. We thought it was the end. Our whole family, and Caleb's brothers and sisters went to Germany, preparing to say our good-bye."
Fortunately, there was good news.
"Turns out she got better and was stable enough to go home. Of course everyone was estactic."
"The same situation happened again this January and this March. Heart attack, hospitalized, it looked like it was over. But then again, she got better and we all went back home."
"Each time, we buy tickets to Germany and back for our whole family, which is about 5-6K. Plus accommodations, plus having to take time off of work and school, which is difficult."
"Last week, my husband got a call that Marie had another heart attack. I told him he could go alone, but me and the kids would stay and he would have to buy his own plane ticket (I am the main income earner)."
"Reason is because I can't take more time off of work, and we cant afford to buy more plane tickets. I also find it difficult to say our heartfelt good-byes every time, only to repeat it two months later."
"Caleb was outraged that I wouldn't let him visit his dying grandmother, calling me all kinds of names, saying I was setting a terrible example for our children. After hearing Marie was okay this time again as well, he calmed down a bit but is giving me the cold shoulder and will refuse to talk to me or acknowledge my presence."
The OP continued:
"I don't know what to do. We are comfortable, but can't afford to take plane trips every few months for who knows how long. And I am not 'keeping my husband away from his grandmother', I am just saying he has to pay for his own ticket if he wants to go."
"AITA?"
Anonymous strangers weighed in by declaring:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA - You're The A**hole
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
- NAH - No A**holes Here
Many Redditors thought the OP was not the a**hole (NTA) here.
"INFO: maybe I'm missing it, but why does Caleb see this as you preventing him from going? You staying home with the kids is not the same as saying he can't go." – Spare-Article-396
"I swear to f'king God, no one on reddit can use their f'king heads. she had spent 20k flying their family out there four times in the last nine months! stop accusing her of financial abuse because she won't pay for another god damn plane ticket."
"she has to think about her kids at some point people. use your f'king heads.NTA." – fleet_and_flotilla
"Right? She also literally said that they can't afford any more plane tickets, like right there in the post. I kind of think that this is a N A H situation, except for the fact that the husband called her all kinds of names, which changed my judgement to NTA."
"Hopefully, this can be a wakeup call; OP's husband has a right to be upset, but not to verbally attack his wife. They should maybe get some counseling and consider putting aside money for him to go visit the next time that he needs to." – RunTimeExcptionalism
"NTA but damn... a tumour and 4 heart attacks in a year and still kicking it, what are they giving that woman." – Podria_Ser_Peor
"NTA. Apparently all the people here that think you're the a-hole don't do math or are independently wealthy. You have spent over $20,000 in the last nine months to go see his dying grandmother who keeps getting better. I don't blame you for deciding that he had to pay for his own ticket."
"I don't know the dynamics of your relationship other than you said he's a stay-at-home dad and does side jobs. But he cannot keep expecting to spend that much money to keep going to see his grandmother and say his goodbyes for her just for her to get better. He needs to start being realistic." – Winter_Dragonfly_452
"I feel like an angle people aren't recognizing is how traumatizing this must be for kids that age- having to go through the grief of saying goodbye to their beloved grandmother and process her death before realizing she'll live Four. Times."
"That's not a healthy cycle to keep bringing them into. I'm not saying keep them from her forever obviously but when the trip is specifically to 'say goodbye' for the 5+ time it's actually a good decision to tell your husband he needs to go on his own this time."
"Reddit has no real info on your budget and if you give your husband spending money AFAIK so all the outrage in the comments abt him being a SAHD without income is misplaced. You've spent $20,000 without complaint in 9 months. Anyone calling you financially abusive has never had a budget before because they are 14. (NTA)" – Cavewedding
"NTA. You already spent $20,000. Then let say you pay for him this time. Now you have to pay for daycare as well as other expenses. She get better. Then two months later it happens again."
"So you supposed to pay again? Each and every time until she finally passes? That's crazy. Money do not grow on trees, and you must think of the financial burden as of now and how it can affect the future." – DaTruCre
"NTA and Caleb is also NTA. Your thinking is reasonable. Caleb's thinking is emotional. No right or wrong here. Sorry if this answer doesn't help." – Becalmandkind
This is a tough time for Caleb to be going through, as it would be for anyone with a family member who is ailing.
The OP clarified a few things for us:
"My husband and I had a big talk last night and I essentially told him what the comments said. We (as a family) are not able to afford going to Germany every few months. I also told him that because I wanted him to be with his grandmother when she passed, I've decided to set aside money for him to visit her."
"However, this would cut into his hobby expenses (he likes to occasionally golf with friends, go to concerts, etc)."
"A lot of people were confused with the financial situation, I've responded in the comments but will repeat it here. I essentially bring in 95% of our money. My husband lost his job a few years ago due to medical reasons."
"We are hopeful he'll be able to return in a few years after more therapy. He is now a SAHD [stay at home dad] but will do side gigs (mowing lawns, repairing things, etc). This is not to discredit him in the slightest, he works very hard and is an amazing father."
"When I said we were 'comfortable,' I meant we had enough to spare a few grand a year (which we already blew on the last visits). We can't afford him going to Germany for who knows how long without cutting into other expenses."
"My husband looked relieved and thanked me. He said he'd try to pick up some extra side jobs to help more financially."
"I know this is not a crazy update, but I want to thank everyone for their help. Hopefully, Grandma will stop having heart attacks and live for a few more years ❤️."
But the OP has also done her best to accommodate the situation within reason.
There are no real villains here.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp