Over the years, it sometimes can feel like Christmas present spending has gotten a bit out of control.
Times are rough for a lot of people this year.
The economy is down, and Christmas could financially tank a person.
So some people are planning to spend judiciously.
This option does not sit well with everyone who expects a gift.
Redditor NotWrongChristmasTA wanted to discuss their experience and get some feedback, so naturally, they came to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subreddit.
They asked:
"AITA for not giving individual Christmas gifts to my sister's kids?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"To start off, my sister and I are not close."
"Nothing happened."
"I don't think she's a terrible person."
"We are just two very, very different people and live very separate lives."
"We text each other on birthdays, and call each other once around the holidays, and that's it."
"We live thousands of miles away from each other, and it's been about 8 years since I've seen her and her family in person."
"I don't have kids, while my sister has always dreamed of a huge family, and she got her wish."
"Between her and her husband, they have 9 kids between the ages of 2 and 16."
"After my sister and her husband got married and the head count reached over 4, I decided to just start getting something for all the kids to share on Christmas."
"Some years it's been something for all of them to do, some years it's been something like a gaming system."
"I figured it was probably nicer to get one expensive gift that they probably wouldn't have gotten rather than 9 cheaper ones."
"My sister's never said anything about it, although I don't know how she really feels about this."
"A week back, I got a surprise call from my sister."
"She said money was super tight this year and was wondering if I could get all the kids something they can unwrap individually, instead of one big thing."
"I asked her to send me their Christmas lists to see what that would look like."
"Most of the kids asked for really expensive electronic items, totally well over 100 bucks a kid."
"If I got everyone something from their list, that would come to well over $1000. I haven't even met some of the kids, and I am not even part of a religion that celebrates Christmas, so I thought that was a ton of cash to drop."
"I called my sister back and said, 'Hey, I appreciate money is tight (because hello, it is she's raising the next line up for the Braves- not that I said that) but I said I'm just not in a position myself to spend over a grand on Christmas gifts."
"My sister got upset and said she just wanted to give the kids all something to open. I said I understood, but unless she was willing to let me know some cheaper options, I wasn't able to spend that much."
"We went back and forth for a while before she snapped and called me a jerk and hung up."
"We haven't spoken since."
"I appreciate the position she's in, but I just can't justify spending that much on Christmas presents."
The OP was left to wonder:
"AITA?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed in on some options to the question, AITA:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
Redditors declared that OP was NOT the A**hole.
"NTA. The cynic in me thinks if you buy those gifts, the labels on them are coming off and getting replaced with 'love from mum and dad.'"
"Do a combined gift, of get they something like pjs, a book, and a hot chocolate each, or an Amazon voucher each (at an affordable value), or just nothing because the level of entitlement from your sister is gross. She's using you as a gift atm. The fact that you've never gotten a thanks or a photo of the kids playing with your gifts tells you all you need to know." ~ Grouchywhennhungry
"I prefer separate gifts (but would never ASK for that). "
"The AH part is expecting OP to change their budget for it."
"Some years, my kids haven't got much from us to open (usually because we've wanted to get a bigger main gift that allows no room for stocking stuffers)."
"When they're young and don't understand value, it can feel a bit sad to unwrap less than a sibling."
"Or it can feel a bit deflating when a sibling who is hooked on things that cost very little, to be 'done' with gift opening while lil sis is tearing open for 19th bag of rocks."
"We love that grandparents like to gift smaller gifts that add to the unwrapping fun."
"Especially when it's off-the-wall stuff we wouldn't have thought of."
"We know it means each item is lower budget, and that's fine!"
"When people ask for lists, we usually just give themed ideas (11 is really into fossicking and Wednesday, 15 loves baking, photography, and Digital Circus)."
"Or we will suggest a store for gift cards if that's offered."
"But I wouldn't dare hand out a list of spendy items that give no leeway for smaller budgets."
"I just can't even. $100/kid for NINE KIDS? Nuh uh."
"Sis's response was telling." ~ Spellscribe
"OP should get each of them a book and write an inscription in the front cover about why they like or liked that book, or just why they picked it out."
"Don't tell the sister and send them wrapped."
"If she replaces the tags, she can explain to those who can read why her name was on OP's gifts." ~ MindOverMuses
"She chose to have 9 kids."
"She should not expect someone else to carry the load at Christmas."
"Even a $20 gift for each child will be $200."
"Or so." ~ PAGirl72
"NTA. It's not up to her to dictate what gift you give and what value."
"Maybe you should send her a box of condoms." ~ Select_Pirate6571
"NTA at all."
"Respectfully, they shouldn't have had more kids than they can afford."
"Downvote me if you want, but 9 kids is way too much."
"I understand wanting a big family, but if you can't even afford a big family, then you're just being selfish."
"Your sister is severely entitled to money and gifts that're not hers, and that she's not even obligated to."
"Especially when you two aren't even close, and you haven't met half of her children."
"She sounds like the type that if you were to send those gifts, she'd definitely put her name on it, to make it seem like she bought the gifts, and take the credit."
"Beggars can't be choosers, and I wouldn't blame you if you opt out of sending any gift at all."
"Your sister sucks, and she's a major AH."
"It's absurd that she's behaving so immaturely."
"Save your money for yourself, or for someone who isn't being so rude and entitled." ~ OverKookie_Crumble
"At least in the present era, having 9 kids is almost certainly an AH move even if you can afford it."
"There's no way that each kid is getting individual attention, and unless they have teams of nannies and helpers, the older kids are almost definitely getting parentified."
"Even if they have armies of nannies, that doesn't mean each kid feels love and attention from their parents."
"I get in the past there wasn't effective family planning, or there was social pressure, or kids might not make it to adulthood, but doing what they're doing in this era is an AH move." ~ ErikLovemonger
"NTA. Having nine kids and complaining 'money is tight' and expecting a single person to pick up the slack is not it."
"I wouldn't buy anything after how she behaved." ~ Purple_Shallot3731
"NTA. Asking for help is one thing."
"Requiring you to spend $100/kid for NINE KIDS is outrageous."
"Millions of kids would kill to open ANY gift on Christmas morning." ~ lovewholly
"NTA. You were willing to buy her kids something to unwrap on Christmas Day, but you had an upper limit." "She didn't like your upper limit and called you a jerk and hung up!"
"She could've agreed to your budget."
"Instead, she was rude."
"That would be me done!" ~ Mullein55
"NTA. Get each of the children an age-appropriate book."
"They aren't too expensive, something to unwrap, the kids can read instead of being bored, and it's good for their education."
"Or smaller sets of Lego and Barbie Dolls." ~ EuropeSusan
"NTA, you aren't close, so she's lucky you do anything at all."
"If I were you, I'd tell her you'll do what you can, and if it's not appreciated, you can do nothing instead."
"Her financial issues are not your problem or responsibility."
"The fact that she doesn't see an issue with her kids requesting expensive things and thinks you're the problem would make me get each one a $10 gift card, and that's it."
"And I'd only do that because they're kids and can't help if their parents are awful." ~ Exoquey
"NTA... like what?"
"If you don't have the money to spend a grand on someone else's kids, you don't have the money."
"There are so many great things for less." ~ gyqu
"NTA. I can see asking for them to each have something individual to open if the items on the list were like $10-20 apiece, but asking family members to subsidize Christmas because she and her husband decided to have more kids than they could realistically afford is unreasonable." ~ SaltySweetMomof2
"My sister has 6."
"I cap it at 30 each; they get cash or a group gift, or I give it to their mum, she shops and shows me what I bought."
"I could never spend 100 each, and she would never expect that."
"Your sister is just getting a reality check on how expensive sh*t is. NTA." ~ XtinaTheGreekFreak
"NTA. Her request is wholly inappropriate, and she sounds pretty entitled for someone who hasn't taken an active interest in your life." ~ GreenVermicelliNoods
Reddit is with you, OP.
Your sister is not thinking clearly.
That is an outrageous amount of money.
Times are tough, money is tight.
And even if times were better and money was growing on trees, this would STILL be an absurd request.
Keep it lowkey.
Happy Holidays!
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp