As the saying goes, it takes a village to raise a child.
But the question the members of the "Am I the A**hole?" (AITAH) needed an answer to was, does the whole village need to be located under the same roof?
Redditor Thin-Childhood-680 had a newborn baby and an incredibly full house, including herself, her baby, her husband, and three out of four of their parents, all of whom were there to help with the baby and the household pets.
When her husband's grandparents wanted her to invite her brother-in-law to also stay with them, the Original Poster (OP) drew the line, pointing out that the house was already full enough, much to their dismay.
She asked the sub:
"Am I the a**hole for not wanting my husband's adult brother to stay at our house for an extended period of time while we have a six-month-old baby and both sets of our parents already living with us?"
The OP had a full house helping with her newborn.
"My husband and I recently had a baby, who is now six months old."
"Right now, both his parents and my parents are staying with us to help take care of the baby."
"Originally, we were not planning on having his parents come stay with us. My mom was going to help with the baby, and then our plan was to send our baby to daycare at around six months old when we both needed to return to work."
"However, my mother-in-law (MIL) did not want our baby to go to daycare at that young of an age, so his parents came to help while we went back to work instead."
"We also have a dog and two cats, and with both of us working, I felt it would be too much for just my mom to handle the baby, plus the pets, herself (my father regularly has to leave the house for other obligations)."
"I personally had no issue with sending our baby to daycare. The extra grandparent help was not something I insisted on, because we don't need three and four adults around for just one baby all the time."
"Anyway, we live in a three-bedroom house, so the house already feels very full."
Then, the OP's parents-in-law wanted to make the house a little bit fuller.
"Recently, my husband’s parents said they want my husband’s adult brother to come stay at our house for a prolonged amount of time, because he was previously staying at their house, but since they're helping us with the child, they don't want the brother to be alone."
"I told my husband I don’t want that right now."
"My reasons are that we already have a lot going on with a baby, there isn’t much room, both sets of grandparents are already here, and I don’t want to worry about feeding/hosting one more adult in the house."
"My husband got angry and said I’m being unreasonable. He said his brother can sleep in the living room, which is mostly unused, and that it won’t cause that much trouble."
"I then tried to suggest that if his parents wanted to take care of or spend time with his adult brother, I would be fine with them going back to their own home to do that, but my husband said I was being mean and unwelcoming."
The OP and her husband already had recurring issues with his brothers staying in their home.
"This has become a very painful recurring issue in our marriage. Right after we got married, one of his brothers stayed with us for almost a year after college while getting set up for a job."
"I had a lot of fights with my husband about it, but I ultimately compromised, and his brother stayed. I also helped his brother with his job search."
"I still feel resentment about that situation, while my husband feels resentment toward me for starting fights about it."
"When I was six months pregnant, I also asked my husband not to have one of his brothers stay with us for an internship. Part of the reason was that this brother had previously been suspected of bringing the pandemic virus to me when I was three months pregnant, and I was worried about getting sick while pregnant."
"We had a big fight about that, too, but I compromised, and his brother stayed for a few weeks anyway."
"Later, when I was close to giving birth, it was around Christmas. Usually, my husband’s family comes over, but I asked that this brother stay at another brother’s apartment about 30 minutes away instead of in our house."
"At that point, we already had both sets of in-laws staying with us, I was about to go into labor, and we were still in a three-bedroom house. That also became a huge fight."
"We also fought when I asked the brother to wear a mask after he had traveled to a conference in Vegas, and to wear masks at work while he was staying with us, because I was pregnant and didn’t want to get sick. My husband thought those requests were unreasonable, too."
The OP felt her husband's resentment building.
"Now my husband keeps a 'list' of all the fights I’ve started with him and uses this list to accuse me of being difficult."
"He says I never welcome his brothers. I feel that’s unfair. One of his brothers, who lives nearby, comes over almost once a month to play games with us. We celebrate his birthday with cake and presents."
"Both brothers come during Christmas, and I feel like I do welcome them. But my husband says that’s just normal and doesn’t count."
"At this point, our marriage feels like it’s at the brink. I feel like I have compromised many times, but my husband only remembers the fights. He feels like I’m rejecting his family. I feel like he prioritizes his brothers’ comfort over my comfort in my own home, especially during pregnancy, postpartum, and now while caring for a baby."
"Am I really so wrong for not wanting my husband’s adult brother to stay with us for a prolonged period right now?"
"AITAH?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
- NTA: Not the A**hole
- YTA: You're the A**hole
- ESH: Everybody Sucks Here
- NAH: No A**holes Here
Some urged the OP to respectively send her parents-in-law home to spend time with her brother-in-law.
"Just tell his parents that they should go home to be with the adult brother so he’s not alone. You do not need that much help with one six-month-old. It’s probably causing more stress than anything." - Critical_Customer_87
"OP’s niceness and patience have been grossly taken advantage of. They’ve made her pregnancy and postpartum time wicked stressful, as well as anxiety-riddled when it should be peaceful and happy. I’m childfree myself, but I am absolutely disgusted by her husband and livid on her behalf." - EfficientFish_14
"Depending if the kid sleeps well, is colicky, or the worst, is teething, in that case, they might need one adult to help them, not four."
"I think that OP and her husband should stick to their plan to put the baby at daycare."
"I also think that OP's husband should focus on his baby: his wife and baby are now HIS family and should be his top priority. Not inviting his brother or parents to stay at OP's home!" - Orsombre
"I can almost guarantee that his parents and him aren’t helping at all, and they want the brother there so bad so the OP will have to host him."
"I think maybe it’s time for her to come down with some 'illness' that doesn’t allow her to leave her bed. Not to work, not to do housework, not to cook or clean, and certainly not to care for a baby."
"Then let’s see what happens…"
"Pretty soon, they will all move out. Then OP’s sister, or cousin, or best friend should move in. And be annoying as all get out. And not pay any rent."
"Strategically, that would be the best time to begin marriage counseling. After her husband has had a taste of his own medicine." - City_Elk
"Her husband is the biggest issue here and absolutely a massive gaping AH. Send the husband and his parents home to go take care of his grown a** brother so he isn’t alone and lonely!"
"OP can have the baby in daycare part-time and have her parents stay with her to help with the baby when the baby's not in daycare and the pets while she’s at work."
"I would be filing for a legal separation and then serving him with divorce papers and getting child support set up. No one needs to live with such a miserable partner who is constantly blaming them for everything and prioritizing his adult, able-bodied family members over his wife and child."
"F**k this guy. Throw the whole man out. Then he can see what not being welcoming REALLY looks like." - MartinisnMurder
Others weren't sure that the OP's vision of the future could work with her husband's obviously multigenerational one.
"Apparently, the happy future Hubby envisions is one in which his entire family lives with them. OP doesn't want that future at all. There's not much of a way to compromise on this. Maybe he should just go with them." - LissaBryan
"I hope the husband is rich or working a gonna-make-him-rich job, because he's going to need to buy a mansion before he decides to bring the entire family into their home and encourage them to live happily ever after together forever. Yuck. Boundaries, who?" - BrassUnicorn87
"NTA. Why are BOTH sets of grandparents staying with you to take care of the baby? I am childless, but that feels like a lot of overkill, and not actually that helpful."
"I'd go ahead and send his parents home. 'Thank you for the offer of help, so happy you could be here for the baby, but if you need to take care of your son, you absolutely should go back home.'"
"As far as your husband, I would welcome his list of fights: Yes, that is a list of all the times I asked you to support me in basic stuff, like my own health, and you didn't. That fight about your brother staying for a year when I didn't want him to, well, he stayed for a year, so you got what you wanted, and I didn't."
"At what point do you support me? At what point do I have any say in what happens in the home?"
"And that last question, that's on you. Maybe you take this opportunity to leave the crowded home, with your own parents, and make space for his family. Get the h**l out of there." - mfruitfly
"None of this sounds like a compromise. It just sounds like he’s breaking you and grinding you into the ground."
"Is this really how you want to live the rest of your life? With someone who doesn’t care about your health or happiness? With someone who viciously keeps lists of what he considers your transgressions?"
"Where is the love? This man sounds like he hates you." - fzooey78
"The husband is really the problem here. What sane person keeps a list of their fights and uses it to win arguments? Not to mention the fact that he puts absolutely no weight on the fact that he won all of those fights."
"So he's just mad that the OP is pushing back at all, not recognizing that she ultimately is the only one ever 'compromising' here."
"He's an immature person who needs to grow up. Maybe he should go back to mom and dad's and grow up with his brother, who apparently can't be left 'alone' for too long." - myssi24
The subReddit was alarmed by how the OP was being treated, especially since she seemed so concerned about having to cook and clean for another person. What all of the extra adults were doing in that house beyond "ooo"-ing and "ahh"-ing at the baby was anyone's guess, but more than likely, they were doing little more than sitting on the couch, expecting fresh coffee.
It would be best for all of the family members to return to their respective homes and visit in reasonable amounts. If the husband wasn't okay with them, maybe he should be like his brother and move in with someone, so he wouldn't be "alone," because pretty soon, if he didn't stop treating the OP this way, he would be.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp