Content Warning: Late Family Members, Car Accident, Coping Mechanism, Survivor's Guilt
No tragedy is kind or forgiving, but there are some tragedies that derail a person's life much more than others.
Sometimes, the grief is just too much to handle alone, empathized the members of the "Am I the A**hole?" (AITAH) subReddit.
Redditor No_King4450 had been in a terrible car accident with his brother-in-law and father-in-law and was the only survivor in his car.
But when his wife distanced herself from him, blaming him for their deaths, the Original Poster (OP) struggled to grieve his late family members and imagine how his marriage could survive.
He asked the sub:
"WIBTA (Would I be the a**hole) if I get a divorce because my wife won't stop blaming me for my father- and brother-in-law's deaths?"
The OP was in a terrible car accident with several family members.
"A couple of years ago, I was out with my father-in-law and younger brother-in-law on a guys night out when a freak accident happened. A seventeen-year-old kid lost control when his brakes went out, and he crashed right into us."
"My brother-in-law died on the spot while my father in law fought for a couple of days in the hospital before he too passed."
"I broke my arm and leg and almost died too but somehow I made it."
The accident ruined the OP's wife's life.
"This has destroyed my wife completely. The woman I knew and loved and married isn't here right now."
"She was a huge daddy's girl, she loved him, and they used to talk on the phone every single day, and everytime he'd see or talk to me, he'd always tell me to take good care of his girl."
"She also loved her younger brother. He was 14 years younger than her, so he was like her first baby."
"Her mood changes every other day now. Sometimes, she's her old caring self, and other times, she can't even look at me, and she'd scream and cuss at me all day long, and she'd blame me for everything."
The OP wasn't sure how much more he could take.
"It's so hard for me, because I loved them too. I loved her dad more than my own absent father, and her brother was like a little brother to me too."
"I still see my father-in-law in that carseat next to me with blood coming out of his mouth and with cuts all over him, and I still see my dead brother in the back. Her blaming me for it all the time makes it a million times harder for me."
What made the situation even worse was that the OP's wife refused any help.
"She doesn't wanna go to couples therapy or any sorts of therapy with or without me, but I've been going but with her blaming me it's basically not doing anything to help me at all."
"I still love my wife to death, and I wanna keep my promise to my late father-in-law to take care of his little girl, but I just can't do it anymore; it's too painful."
"I believe it'd be better for her to not live with who she blames for destroying her family, and I think it'd be better for me too and it might finally let me move on."
"Should I do it or should I give her another chance? I don't wanna put her trough even more pain, but I think this would be helpful for both of us."
"WIBTA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
- NTA: Not the A**hole
- YTA: You're the A**hole
- ESH: Everybody Sucks Here
- NAH: No A**holes Here
Some Redditors were concerned by the fact that the OP's wife was refusing help.
"NTA. We know she's hurting, badly. But to blame you, and refuse to go to counseling, is completely unfair. Even without that, the way her moods are all over the place shows she needs it."
"Ultimatums are usually a bad idea, but not always. Have you considered telling her it's counseling or divorce?" - carmelfan
"Tell her the promise you made her dad. And tell her if SHE won't let you help her, then you'll be breaking that promise, and you dont want to do that."
"Tell her HE would want her to get help."
"If she still refuses, avoid her while home a bit. Do you have a separate bedroom or man cave? You can try to spend most of your time there. Try to keep out of her line of sight so she isn't reminded."
"If need be, you can do a trial separation. Go live somewhere else for a bit, but keep tabs on her."
"No need to jump right to divorce." - Charlie24601
"She MUST know what she is doing is wrong, borderline evil. That's why she won't go to therapy. I respect your commitment to her, but you may need to get a separate place for your own mental wellbeing."
"She's punishing you a second time when you're already suffering by being the survivor. Sadly, I don't see a happy marriage in your future with her." - MeatofKings
"At this point, it's not even an ultimatum. It's what OP has to do. If the wife is refusing therapy, she will constantly be dealing with the resentment towards OP. It's bad enough he is likely already dealing with his own survivor's guilt but to be constantly blamed when it was not even his fault is something I can't see him withstanding."
"OP, it's time to let your wife know that you have to think about yourself and your own mental health in this situation, and leave. If she's refusing help, it will never get any better." - BizarreCujoh
"She SHOULD be hating the person who CAUSED the crash that killed her dad and brother, but she's constantly reminded that OP was the only SURVIVOR of the crash."
"It's so painful to OP's wife to be reminded, but she is refusing any kind of therapy to come to terms with her loss."
"OP is entitled to seek therapy for his own mental health. He is dealing with PTSD and anxiety issues related to the deaths of his father in-law and brother in-law." - Feeling-Invite7953
One Redditor advised what the OP should tell his wife if she continued to refuse help.
"OP, if it were me, I would say something like this, 'I love you, but I cannot live the rest of my life being hated and blamed for a freak accident, something that was not my fault. You treat me as if you would rather I had died in the car rather than survived.'"
"'I'm so sorry the accident happened, but it was not my fault and you hating me is not going to bring your father and brother back. I do not want a divorce but I cannot live with your hatred any longer, so I will be moving out. If you want to continue to be married to me, you will need to get therapy. If you choose not to in the next six months, I will be filing for divorce.'"
"'Maybe we can both be happier if you don't have to look at me daily and be reminded of your loss. I really do love you so much and wish the accident had never happened, but neither of us has any control over that. All we can do is control how we move forward, and if you are not willing to get help, then we need to move forward separately.'" - Successful_Voice8542
Others thought it might be better for the OP and his wife to go their separate ways so they could both heal.
"Hate is the poison that kills only the hater. She should learn forgiveness, even if her husband caused it. If she does blame him, justly or unjustly, she needs therapy. And she may not be able or heal with him still in her life." - MetaPlayer01
"You can frame it a few ways... I'd suggest something like, 'You seem to hate me sometimes, and I seem to be a constant reminder of what happened. That's hard for me to be around, especially as I'm grieving them as well. If we can't go to counseling together, maybe we shouldn't be together.'" - BodaciousVermin
"You can't help someone who doesn't want it. Don't divorce her now, don't make big decisions at a time like this, but separation for a time might be good for both of you."
"Get a short term rental, three to six months maybe, and keep up your therapy. Being the one left behind is harder than most people think, and you need to keep talking to someone, but not her." - Beth21286
"Tell her that you are considering divorce, and unless she's willing to go to counseling this relationship is on its last legs. She goes to counseling or she can expect seperation to start soon."
"You need to be firm. If she doesnt know she is going to lose you by doing this, and doesnt feel like she will (for example, empty threats to leave) she wont ever snap out of it."
"The longer you take to impress this, the more obstinate she will be." - Grimwohl
"This is beyond salvageable OP marriage-wise."
"She's unwilling to accept that it was not your fault that freak accident that occurred and had it been possible to turn back time in a time machine and she still wouldn't have been able to change the devastating outcome because of the other driver that lost control of the vehicle and crashed into you."
"Best to get your divorce papers in order and served to her then try start living the best you can." - lovemyfurryfam
Grief after such a loss can be difficult for couples.
We wish them both well as they navigate these turbulent waters.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp