Especially since 2020, many of us have struggled to separate the space where we work and where we live, and we long for a space where we can purely relax.
But wanting to have our own space can create tension with the people we love the most, agreed the "Am I the A**hole?" (AITA) subReddit.
After moving into the home his father inherited, Redditor ThrowRABunkerMan was pleased to discover what his grandfather had created there.
But when his wife began to question the time he was spending away from her, the Original Poster (OP) wondered how they could compromise.
He asked the sub:
"AITA for spending a lot of time in my bunker away from my family?"
The OP had heard of the bunker his grandfather built.
"My grandfather was an incredibly talented man who also suffered from paranoid schizophrenia."
"He was convinced that the nuclear apocalypse was going to end the human race at some point, so he built his own bunker."
"Then he buried the entrance because he was convinced that both the KGB and the CIA were watching him and wanted to keep the bunker a secret."
"Yes, he was a crazy man."
The OP made an amazing discovery when he inherited the home.
"My dad inherited his house but never lived there."
"When I had my first child in 2018 and got married in 2019, my dad made me an incredibly generous offer for the house. I bought computers that were more expensive than the house."
"The bunker became kind of an urban legend, mostly because my old grandpa used to tell a lot of crazy stories."
"But out of curiosity, I went looking for it and found the entrance. THE OLD MAN REALLY DID IT!"
"So, thanks to being stuck at home during the uneventful 2020 and 2021, I started remodeling the bunker to look less like a Fallout Vault and more like my own man cave."
"Everyone loves it, especially the kids (my nephews and friend's children)."
"So the house is decorated to my wife's taste, while I can do whatever I want in the bunker, play gaming, fix computers, set up a whole home server, work from home, etc."
But the magic was wearing off for the OP's wife.
"However, lately, my wife has been complaining about me being distant and spending a lot of time there and less time with her and our child."
"She is pregnant again, so she said she was worried, but I just promised to spend more time at the house."
"After a few weeks, that wasn't enough for her, and she accuses me of abandoning her."
"I'm asking for judgment here because I'm trying to be there for my family, but this bunker feels like it's the only thing that's really mine and where I can actually have a break."
"My wife has said she's going to seal the entrance; otherwise I might miss the birth and not even notice."
"Should I just move all my stuff into the house and forget about it?"
"Am I really being neglectful, or is this just her pregnancy hormones talking?"
The OP shared a few clarifications.
"To be clear, I do help with the house chores and spend time with my son when I'm there, and I have an intercom in the bunker so my wife can just call me if she needs anything and I'll go up there immediately."
"I spend at least six hours at the bunker on weekdays. I work there so I think that is reasonable. And I spend at least four hours on weekends."
"I forgot to mention: Our son goes to kindergarten, so my wife has time to work and sometimes be alone at home."
"AITA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
- NTA: Not the A**hole
- YTA: You're the A**hole
- ESH: Everybody Sucks Here
- NAH: No A**holes Here
Some didn't think these were enough hours to make the OP the AH.
"If we consider the weekend as roughly 6:00 PM Friday to 6:00 AM Monday, that's 60 hours. Is four hours really that unreasonable? Two hours a day for himself?"
"If he spent every waking moment there and did no chores, then I'd feel differently. He makes his living in that space. It's part of his family history. The wife seems to want his undivided attention."
"Probably unpopular, but NTA." - TexasGal0032548
"People forget that there are 24 hours in a day. Assuming he gets his eight hours of sleep, he's only spending a quarter of his waking weekend hours in the bunker, call it two hours in the morning and two at night, and that's a super reasonable amount of time."
"I don't even care about the six hours during the week, a normal job would have you away for eight to ten hours at least. Reddit just hears an upset pregnant woman and automatically assumes OP is the A H."
"NTA unless OP does absolutely nothing with the other 75% of his weekend and 100% of his weekday free time." - Risque_MicroPlanet
"Wait, you work from home (or work from bunker?) for six hours a day and then spend four hours in there over the weekend?"
"NTA, and all of these people are saying otherwise just because of their blatant prejudice. Most jobs, because Reddit users seem to forget, involve AT LEAST EIGHT HOURS elsewhere. Big f**king deal."
"So long as you're an active father, you're allowed your own (literal) man cave."
"Props on the bada** bunker, but try not to be too secluded. It's friggin awesome, but so is being a family." - DragonfruitOk6901
Others thought the OP started being the AH with the weekend hours.
"The six hours a day during the week, when he works there, is NTA."
"The four hours at weekends make him the AH." - ThatFatGuyMJL
"NTA for the weekdays as I can even get behind the bunker being your office and you're away for the workday."
"YTA for the weekends… is this four hours per day? In any case, it doesn't even matter. Where is your wife's break during the weekend? Why does she need to 'call you' on the intercom?"
"You have a child and she's pregnant. You should be readily available without her having to call you."
"Let's be honest, it's not about the bunker. YTA for being a bad husband and not being present. If your wife is worried you might miss the birth of your kid and not notice, you're definitely spending more time than you've told us." - ImHungryFeedMe
"NTA. I have needed alone time daily for most of my life. I'm an introvert and need it for my mental health and many people don't understand this."
"That said, you are likely down there too much. Leave it for a while unless you are working. Make sure your wife feels supported and your kid sees you enough to get bored of you."
"Then start easing back. Sometimes after the baby is born and settled." - Waitforsigns64
Some understood the wife's concerns about quality time, but with mixed ratings.
"NTA, but I think your wife is trying to tell you something. When you go to your cave, you are physically removing yourself. That's a lot different than being in the house and doing your own thing."
"I think you should consider moving some of your more routine activities inside the house." - Minute_Point_949
"YTA. I was leaning toward NTA, but then I realized you said you 'spend time with your son when you're there' and 'You're trying to be there for your family,' and 'Should I just move all my stuff into the house....'"
"Those aren't things a person who lives there says. So apparently YOU feel like you don't LIVE there, so it's no wonder your wife feels like you're not there enough." - _Nana_111
"Demanding you give up your own space is 100% overreacting, but there might still be a legitimate grievance beneath it, I wouldn't just dismiss her."
"Have you tried making any agreements? Like always having dinner together, making a plan for the household chores and childcare responsibilities, trying to compare expectations, making a point to fit quality time in your schedule, etc?"
"Rather than vaguely 'promise to spend more time at the house,' maybe make a concrete agreement so you can show you did your part, and it isn't up to subjective arguments of how much is 'enough' time."
"I think there can probably still be a diplomatic solution here if you talk to each other and try to have an open ear for each other's needs (which must include your needs to have a private place to recharge, but also that you do your part with childcare and house chores)." - RafflesiaArnoldii
As the comments poured in, the OP started taking notes.
"Guys, I swear I'm taking notes. I'm just trying to understand what I should change about myself and how to talk to my wife about this."
"Remember that I spend at least six hours WORKING, not scratching my belly. My manager allows me to log out early if I finished my work for the day, but I can't log out if I've been working for less than six hours. I also spend time talking with my team on Slack."
"And so many of you are picking up on my language. I would appreciate it if you explain calmly why my choice of words is so bad so I don't f**k things up when I speak to my wife."
The OP later said he needed time to process.
"Mini-Update: I had a talk with my wife. Overall, I think it went well since she told me everything, but there are so many raw emotions right now, and I was sent to sleep in the spare room."
"She had no mercy on me, but we needed this talk, so we can have a clear path for our future together."
Finally, the OP shared a very thoughtful update.
"I talked to my wife. I asked her to be very honest, and I promised to let her talk until she was done."
"First of all, it's not just about the time I spend in the bunker now, but she felt completely alone taking care of our little baby while I spent almost all of my free time remodeling and building and when it was done, I'm just down there."
"I explained to her that it was basically my office now, and she understood and apologized and then continued to explain herself."
"I'll just quote the gist of what she said to me, because we talked for hours."
"My wife confided, 'I haven't been my own person since my first pregnancy, I feel like a doll, every day is the same, I'm bored, frustrated, angry, just when I thought it might get easier, I get pregnant again, how many years until I can just be me again?'"
"'You have a big hole underground where you can play and not care about the world. I haven't read a book in years, I can't read two pages without falling asleep.'"
"(For context, she's always been a bookworm, and loves books and the aesthetic of having shelves full of them, but it's true she hasn't read in a long time. I gave her a Kindle for our anniversary and I pay for her audible subscription. I thought those would be good substitutes, but they're not.)"
"'Yes, the house looks nice, but what about a place for me? I don't want a Kindle, I don't want audiobooks to listen to while cooking or driving. I want a PHYSICAL collection, but where do I put them? When was the last time I went to a library? When was the last time you gave me something made of real paper?'"
"'Stop thinking that a screen can solve everything. I need you with me, I married a human, not a sim. Download some emotions.'"
"'I want to write again, but how? When? Will you read my first crappy drafts or just take a look and say it's okay?'"
"'Can you have our son in the bunker for a few hours a day? He's bored here, he won't be bored down there.'"
Now back to me: It was hard, but I needed it, and she needed it."
"I'm going to move my gaming consoles into the house and see if I can set up SteamLink to stream games from my gaming PC to our TV or something."
"We agreed to go on dates outside the house, and I'm going to take on more responsibilities around the house."
"I want to address something. I was told by my parents that I had to 'help' with the house and 'help' with the kids. But then I come to Reddit and it turns out that 'helping' is a problem."
"You talked a lot about mental load, but this was the first time I heard about it, who was supposed to teach me that? 'Helping,' not having addictions, being loyal and always being there seemed like what every good husband does, now I realize it was just the bare minimum."
"I feel like I have to relearn everything, and it's hard to realize that I'm a bad husband and father for thinking that the bare minimum was all I needed to have a long and happy marriage."
"I became a Reddit villain by being clueless, but I accept that."
"I'll see you again soon, thank you all."
The subReddit could agree that the bunker was a wonder and an amazing piece of family heritage. They could also understand someone wanting to have their own space, especially when they worked from home and their spaces had become blurred over time.
But it was clear a compromise needed to be created for the couple to continue to funtion. While the bunker was working for the OP, it was not working for his wife, and they needed to figure out a way to make their living arrangement work for everyone in the home.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp