Driving can be dangerous.
That's why being careful is key to survival.
If a car is totaled, the loans and insurance payments don't always go away.
But that doesn't always impede reckless behavior.
Redditor redwayit wanted to discuss his experience and get some feedback, so naturally, he came to the "Am I The A**hole" (AITA) subreddit.
He asked:
"AITA for demanding my son repay the car I bought him after he totaled it street racing?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I (49 M[ale]) helped my son (20 M) get a car when he started college about 2 years ago."
"I co-signed and put about $12k down on a used but pretty reliable car for him."
"From the start, I told him it was not a gift, it was more like a loan from me."
"The idea was that once he had a job, he would start paying me back monthly, and also that if he started driving like an idiot, I would take the car back."
"Last weekend, he completely totaled it."
"Turns out he was doing street racing stuff with some friends."
"The car is gone, and now insurance is pushing back because it happened during illegal activity."
"There is still about $8k left on the loan, so right now I'm the one stuck with it."
"He does have a part-time job, but honestly, most of his money goes to partying and games."
"I told him he needs to start paying me back."
"I asked for $300 a month until it's paid off."
"I also said if he refuses, I might take it to small claims because I really don't want to be the one paying for a car he destroyed doing something stupid."
"He blew up at me and said I'm heartless and kicking him while he's down because the accident 'traumatized' him."
"He said parents are supposed to help their kids, not treat them like debtors."
"My ex-wife (his mom) is also on his side and says if I didn't want this situation, I should have just given him the car."
"Some friends say $12k is a lot of money, and accidents happen, so I should just let it go."
"But to me, the deal was clear from the start, and he broke it in a pretty big way."
The OP was left to wonder:
"AITA for expecting him to stick to the deal and pay me back?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed in on some options to the question, AITA:
- NTA – Not The A**hole
- YTA – You're The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH – Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared that OP was NOT the A**hole.
"NTA. His bratty entitled attitude means that it is really important that he is held accountable for this, that there are consequences for his actions."
"Letting him off the hook will just amplify his stupid behavior." ~ stemroach101
"This. He needs to feel how shi**y it is to have to pay this off, so he doesn't do anything this stupid again."
"If it doesn't impact him, he's just going to keep making stupid choices." ~ OneFit6104
"Exactly. I knew a 'winner' in H[igh] S[chool] whose parents bought him a car, and he immediately put a nitrous bottle on it and blew the motor."
"Somehow, he got away with getting his parents to put two new motors in it with him immediately reinstalling the nitros and blowing it up before his parents caught on."
"He will never learn his lesson if he gets away with this Scott-free." ~ ArtisticAd7455
"When I was 17, I got into a car accident that was entirely my fault... I wasn't intentionally doing something stupid, but I was an impatient teen, and I made a very scary mistake."
"My parents' car had about $12-13k in damage too. "
"Thankfully for me, I was physically okay (for the most part), and our car insurance covered it."
"BUT... in hindsight do wish my parents had made me do something like pay for my car insurance (or at least the amount that it increased after the accident), because it would have taught me to be more responsible, in general, at an earlier age."
"OP, you're trying to teach your kid to be responsible. "
"The idea that you should let it go because 'it's a lot of money' is a*inine."
"The fact that it's a lot of money is exactly why your son should be paying you back."
"Let this go, and you'll be bankrolling even more of his expensive mistakes over the next few years. NTA."
"ETA: Get him some therapy too, because I'm sure he is traumatized."
"But it doesn't have to be either/or; you can address the trauma AND the lack of good decision-making." ~ Impulsive_Ruminator
"I would add that your role as a parent is indeed to help your children."
"Help them be responsible adults who are able to function on their own in society, that is."
"Teaching your son to deal with the consequences of his actions and being held accountable for damages he has caused others is absolutely helping him." ~ fietscombi
"This right here."
"Its parents are NOT doing this, that is why there are so many entitled brats these days."
"I made mistakes when young, my parents helped me out financially, and I paid them back."
"It sucks for him, but it was his choice to do something stupid (and this is coming from a former streetracer many moons ago), and he needs to pay the piper." ~ Cornflakecwl2
"Hopefully, he's on your ex-wife's insurance."
"She might start to sing a different tune when her renewal comes in."
"NTA at all." ~ Massive-Beginning994
"NTA. He needs to learn that actions have consequences."
"He wrecked the car racing it illegally."
"Insurance won't cover it due to the illegal activity."
"If he can't/won't realize that his actions mean he will be out of a car AND he has to pay the balance, then sue him."
"His mom can chip in if she wants, too..."
"You told him at the beginning this was not a GIFT, but a LOAN... he should've known better... one very expensive lesson to learn...AND he 100% dug this hole BY HIMSELF!!!!" ~ politicallymoderate2
"NTA, this wasn't an accident; it was the direct result of his reckless behavior."
"He's lucky he just has to pay money and not face charges for killing someone because this could have ended much worse for him." ~ SPlNPlNS
"NTA, your son apparently needed the fullness of the lesson."
"He's lucky he didn't hurt anyone or worse."
"He put himself in this position."
"I met a young woman years ago (she was 21), she wrecked her first two cars, and her parents bought her a third, which permanently injured a friend of hers when she wrecked that one."
"Her parents regretted not making a decision to stop her." ~ whatsmypassword73
"NTA. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes."
"He'd better be careful that charges from the police or insurance aren't coming as well, but you definitely shouldn't be on the hook for it."
"That isn't just doing something stupid; it is also doing something illegal."
"It kinda sounds like he knows the buzzwords that get your ex on his side."
"You gotta shut that down."
"I'll be honest, it might really sour your relationship."
"But he will be infinitely better off for it."
"Imagine if someone had been hurt or died."
"He needs to understand the gravity of the situation." ~ Kingalthor
"NTA. F**k around, find out."
"If insurance doesn't pay out, he has to pay you back."
"Period."
"12k on a car was very generous, let alone racing in that." ~ I_-AM-ARNAV
"NTA. You need to give this kid a dose of reality."
"He thinks you should be gentle with him after he trashed a car that didn't even belong to him."
"He needs to learn some responsibility."
"Don't let it go."
"Make sure he pays."
"He doesn't need to party or game." ~ Regular_Boot_3540
"NTA. Your son sounds a smidgen entitled."
"He's an adult, he made an adult decision, time to face the adult consequences."
"Especially since you had made it clear from the start that it was not a gift, but rather a loan." ~ Big_Orange5413
"NTA. It wasn't an accident."
"He chose to engage in a high-risk activity that could easily have led to his death."
"He needs to be feeling the pain of consequences, because that might be what makes him think for a few seconds before he does it again."
"If you start to waver, you could be burying him right now, or visiting him in prison after he killed someone else."
"He made a stupid decision, and he needs to be the one to bear the burden of it." ~ Cloverose2
"NTA. Having him face the consequences of his actions (repayment) while still being the safety net (you're covering the loan) is helping him, even if he's too immature to see it."
"He's lucky he didn't end up expelled or in jail with the rest of his bad-influence friends."
"HE made the decision to do something stupid and dangerous, HE is old enough to know better, HE needs to take responsibility like a mature adult." ~ shdgaf
"NTA - He was f**king around breaking adult laws with equipment he didn't own."
"He's lucky he didn't kill anyone."
"Stand firm until he learns the lesson."
"Dont be cruel, you don't want him to hate you forever." ~ madsheeter
"NTA - This is one of those crucial teachable moments in his life."
"If you give in, he will learn that with enough fuss, he can get away with anything, even if he is the one in the wrong."
"He needs to take responsibility now or he never will." ~ AlarmingKale1997
"NTA, but make sure not to get him a new car."
"Any and all things he wants, he can get himself."
"He needs to grow up and see that stuff needs to get paid for."
"It sucks that his mom does not see it as a big issue."
"But someone needs to teach/show him that even if things happen that traumatize/scare you, if you did something illegal, you will have to pay for it."
"If it weren't you, it would be something else that wouldn't care about him." ~ Emisys
Reddit supports you, OP.
Actions have consequences.
Your son is about to learn the hard way.
$8K is A LOT of money.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp