With the passage of time, we sometimes don't see people who were once dear friends as often as we like. That is if we don't lose contact with them altogether.
However, some people have friends or friend groups that, come hell or high water, vow that they will always be there for one another.
While most acknowledge that this isn't always possible, others take this vow a little too literally.
Redditor That-Interaction9879 had developed a friend group in college who made such a vow.
The dynamic was slightly threatened, however, when all but one of them got married and had children in their mid/late twenties.
When this odd one out eventually joined all of them as a wife and mother, she was not at all pleased that the group wasn't there to help her adjust to motherhood.
Something the original poster (OP) was unafraid to say was not their responsibility.
Wondering if she was being too harsh, the OP took to the subReddit "Am I The A**hole" (AITA), where she asked fellow Redditors:
"AITA for telling my friend it's her fault for getting married and having kids late because the world won't wait on her now."
The OP explained why she felt her friend had unreasonable expectations in regard to how her friends should be helping her.
"I (39 F[emale]) have a 6-person girl group since college (37-39 F) and that includes Mary (38 F)."
"We've been close throughout the years and have been at milestone events for each other."
"Mary just had a baby and is completely fitting the crazy new mother stereotype."
"In college, Mary has always been someone who had to make it known that she was unique/different from the rest of us, which wasn't as draining then as it has become now."
"For starters, all other women in our circle got married between the ages of 22-27, and we all have multiple kids."
"So the 5 of us were able to experience those milestones alongside one another and got closer as we shared similar lifestyles."
"Mary was very adamant on not settling until her 30s because she wanted to travel and have different experiences, which we all supported."
"Regardless, she would continue to make comments about how she's so lucky, unlike us, because we're 'tied down with husbands and babies'."
"I think this is where she grew resentment towards us because we were in different places in life, and she was upset we couldn't have our group be similar to how it was in college."
"Then into our mid-30s, it became a whole saga of she's getting older and can't find a husband because all the 'good men' are married or divorced with kids."
"When she finally got married, many could not attend because it was a destination event and child-free during Covid."
"This caused a fight because she said how she was there for us during our weddings, but we couldn't put aside a week for her."
"We had all told her how we wished we could, but it simply was not financially feasible and didn't logistically work with our kids."
"But she just refused to hear us out and was simply so inconsiderate about our lives and families, saying we were horrible friends."
"Now, Mary just gave birth to her first child, and I was very excited for her."
"The only issue is that she moved from our state to a very remote place that's only accessible by a 6-hour car ride."
"Her baby is 6mo old, and none of us have been able to go up to visit her."
"I think she's been having a wrong idea of what a 'village' is and has essentially demanded in our group chat that we come up for the holidays and help her out because she's having a hard time adjusting to mom life."
"But this would entail we all take a week off, arrange childcare, figure out transportation, and book hotels during the holidays."
"It's gotten to the point where she's posting cryptic messages on Facebook bashing 'fake friends' who won't be there for her."
"As much as I wish I could, I cannot physically support her in the way she needs me to do in this stage of life."
"It would have been completely different if she still lived in our city, and this was earlier in life when we had fewer commitments/priorities."
"So I told her this and that if she was hoping for this big village and constant support, she should have thought about that when planning out her life because we can't all just pause our lives for her."
"So AITA?"
Fellow Redditors weighed in on where they believed the OP fell in this particular situation, by declaring:
- NTA: Not the A**hole
- YTA: You're the A**hole
- ESH: Everybody Sucks Here
- NAH: No A**holes Here
In the end, no one came off looking particularly good to the Reddit community.
Many agreed that Mary had very unrealistic expectations of what her friends were capable of, but also felt that the OP was being overly harsh and judgmental towards Mary and her decision to get married and have children later in life.
"ESH."
"Let's just ignore the destination wedding."
"Your comment about her life choices was out of line and rude."
"How does she line up her life with yours exactly?'
"How does she 'plan' to have kids when you did?"
"If she can't find a partner to connect with in that time period, that's a real a**hole thing to bring up."
"Now she's also acting immature and thoughtless."
"And bringing this nonsense to social media always makes someone an AH in my opinion."-TheSciFiGuy80
"ESH."
"Your friend is delusional for her demands, but this has nothing to do with your timelines."
"If she had kids when you did, you would've had your own little kids to take care of."
"If anything, your kids are now around ten, so it should be easier to take off a week."
"The issue is that she lives too far away for you to help support her."
"It was as rude for you to shame her for having standards and living her life as it was for her to shame you for not being able to attend her wedding."
"If you want to be in her life, I hope you sent her baby gifts."
"If you don't, no harm, no foul."- dobbysreward
Others felt that the OP was solely at fault, feeling that she was purely judging Mary for not getting married or having children till her 30s.
"YTA."
"You were once the 'typical new mom,' and you had the support of your friends."
"Mary went about things a different way, and she deserves ridicule and abandonment for that?"
"You sound smug af that your friend is struggling now."
"That's not a good look."- opensilkrobe
"It looks like you are purposely leaving out information, only dropping little bits here and there like 'she was there for us during our weddings.'"
"This whole thing reads as if you resent her for making different choices."
"It also reads as if she was there a lot for you and the other 'friends' during the important things, yet you can't be bothered to even show up once for her."
"All you do is make excuse after excuse."
"'Can't find childcare,' why?"
"Don't the kids have a father who can look after them for a few days while you visit your friend?"
"'Have to get a hotel' again, why?"
"Can't you sleep in her guest room or her couch?"
"Or better yet, book a family vacation for a week, of which you visit her a few times?"
"It looks like your friendship is very one-sided. She made effort, took time and energy to put in you and your family for 2 decades, and you can't be bothered to return that even once."
"All you do is complain about how she feels (feeling lucky she has the ability to travel in her 20s for instance) and take some personal offense to it."
"Have you ever even brought that up with her?"
"Ever told her how those comments make you feel, or even ask what she means by them?"
"Yes, you are YTA here, and you are not a friend to her, and I'm wondering if you ever have been."-Tigress92
"Eh… so for 6 months, no one has found ANY time to go see her baby?"
"Even for a few hours?"
"Yeah…. Kinda sounds like you guys just don't care about her."
"YTA."- Interfectrix_veritas
It's very easy to question, even look down upon, people who don't live their lives exactly as we do.
Or to feel neglected by our friends, who we thought always had our backs.
In this case, it seems that Mary and the OP need to pause and reflect a little bit.
Mary needs to understand that people can't just drop everything and be with her at a moment's notice. Meanwhile, the OP should remember that being a new mom comes with many challenges and could be a little more compassionate to her lifelong friend.
Hopefully, both of them will come to realize that a true friendship is never worth sacrificing over a grudge.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp