Dressing for a wedding is always an issue.
It is especially thorny for a bride and groom planning a theme or a "look."
Not everybody will fit into the perfect idea.
Case in point...
Redditor ilovewafflefries1225 wanted to discuss her experience and get some feedback. So naturally, she came to visit the “Am I The A**hole” (AITA) subReddit.
She asked:
"WIBTA for wanting 'immodest' bridesmaid dresses for my wedding?"
The Original Poster (OP) explained:
"I (20 F[emale]) am getting married next summer."
"I grew up in a VERY religious household but was able to 'flee the toxicity' as I like to say."
"The rest of my family are all still very active members in that church."
"I asked my 2 sisters (22, 17) to be my bridesmaids."
"Within said religion, once you reach a certain age you’re eligible to make extra promises and one of those promises is that you’ll remain chaste (no premarital sex, wear modest clothing, etc)."
"You’re then given 'the magical underwear' to wear at all times."
"They essentially resemble knee-length shorts and a cap-sleeve t-shirt, but an 'underwear' type material."
"My older sister has been wearing these for about 3 years now."
"Earlier today, we went shopping for bridesmaid dresses."
"The vision I have for my wedding is simple, but particular."
"I would prefer my bridesmaid’s wear the same dress (Spaghetti straps, knee-length, flowy, semi exposed back and chest)."
"My mom and older sister, during the entirety of this appointment, sat there and told me that I needed to be accommodating towards her religious needs with finding a dress for her that completely covers her underwear."
"Normally, I wouldn’t have a problem with this, but this is for my wedding!"
"I’ll wear what she wants for hers, so I don’t get why it’s such a big deal for mine."
"My mom tried to say it was the same as a Muslim woman wanting to accommodate for her Hijab."
"Please correct me if i used the wrong terminology!!:"
"Or a member of Jewish faith wearing a Yarmulka (again, please correct me if needed)."
"I don’t know if maybe it’s because I’m looking at it all with 's**t-colored glasses' but I don’t think it’s the same thing."
"They’re just underwear to me, and people have to wear underwear to accommodate different clothing all the time so why is this any different?"
"Anyways, part of me wants to just rescind my invitation for her to be in the bridal party since it’s already caused so much drama."
"But I know that it will only cause more if I do."
"I’d be risking my younger sister pulling out as a bridesmaid and I would be risking losing the financial help my parents have offered (that I am INCREDIBLY grateful for!)."
"I don’t want her to be uncomfortable but I also want my wedding to look and be a certain way."
"So, am i the a**hole for not choosing a dress that accommodates her?"
Redditors shared their thoughts on this matter and weighed some options to the question AITA?:
- NTA - Not The A**hole
- YTA – You’re The A**hole
- NAH – No A**holes Here
- ESH - Everyone Sucks Here
Many Redditors declared OP WAS the A**hole.
Let's hear some thoughts...
"I feel like I'll get down voted for this but I can't not say it."
"You're too young to get married."
You've only lived outside of the church for a blink of an eye."
'And you haven't got the emotional maturity to figure out this bridesmaid situation."
"You don't know who you are, or what you prioritise."
"You shouldn't get married when you're still so young and new to the world." ~ bleepybleeperson
"As a fellow cult survivor… don’t get married yet."
"Yeah, yeah, I know getting married early is 'the norm' and maybe the last cult thing you’re still tied to."
"But what you think you want at 20 is not at all what you want at 25, 30, 35, etc."
"Don’t do it. There’s nothing wrong with simply dating."
"ESH is the official judgment." ~ DoubleBreastedBerb
"This! OP, if you listen to anything, please listen to this!"
"Even without the toxicity of your upbringing, 20 isn’t even old enough to truly know yourself."
"Let alone to know a partner well enough to decide that you are compatible for an entire lifetime."
"With that toxicity, your 'normal meter' is going to be completely and utterly skewed."
"You’re not even going to be close to realizing how many things that you grew up believing were just a normal part of life to be endured are actually the result of people wilfully teaching you to allow your personal boundaries to be trampled."
"If this guy is the right guy for you, he will have absolutely no problem waiting to get married."
"He will understand your past and how important it is for you to fully resolve it."
"Please, please, consider taking a bit of extra time to work with a therapist on learning what is and isn’t healthy boundaries."
"And how to maintain your own while respecting those of others."
"Trust me, a wedding is one day but a healthy marriage is a lifetime."
"Don’t sacrifice the long haul in a rush for that one day!" ~ SeePerspectives
OP had some thoughts...
"Edit: This has brought in more attention than I thought it would."
"So I figured I should add a couple more things to help clarify."
"1) I didn’t want to have an actual wedding in the first place."
"We’re only doing this because our families were sad about the fact that they wouldn’t get to see us get married if we did things how we wanted to."
"So essentially, if they want me to have a wedding that’s fine but I want to do it my way. I’m already going out of my way to accommodate to them wanting to be there."
"I don’t want to push it further by having them dictate the whole day."
"The dresses are just the start of what they’ll push around once they realize they have a tiny bit of leeway."
"2) The help my parents are providing isn’t a substantial amount."
"I am footing 90% of the wedding costs."
"tThe little bit that they’re helping out with means so much to me and more or less it 'signifies' that we’re on good terms (very rocky relationship with them growing up)."
"3) I want nothing to do with this religion I left."
"I’ve dug deep into the history and know that it’s all lies brought up by con-men and murdering people because God told them too and having child brides etc etc etc."
"I can’t change the fact that my family are practicing this religion still."
"But I don’t want it to dictate my wedding."
"This is my last real step to 'freedom' from the cult and the fact that it still has such a hold on every decision?? I’m not okay with it."
"It’s not just about the dress, or the undergarments."
"Edit 2: I appreciate the honesty that a lot of you have provided!"
"It has definitely helped me realize some things and make decisions."
"I WBTAH here."
"I will be asking both of my sisters to step down as bridesmaids and just have my matron of honor participate (same to the groomsmen/best man, yes this has been discussed with my future husband)."
"I realize that while I have the right to make whatever wedding I have, how I want to have it, I DID cross a boundary with my sister."
"i can’t ask her to wear something she’s not comfortable in just for my own wants."
"This is ultimately the best decision for keeping the peace as well as keeping my own standards for the wedding."
"I would also like to say to everyone that thinks i’m too young to get married: I don’t care!"
"I am confident and happy in the decision i am making to marry who i’m marrying and if things end up not working out down the road?"
"Then so be it."
"This is the decision we’re making for us and that’s that."
Reddit continued...
"YTA. Regardless of religion, you can't push people to wear clothing they're uncomfortable with just because it's your day."
"Either find a new dress or remove her from the bridal party." ~ Vixen7-9
"Right. This has nothing to do with religion."
"I have a big chest and need a good bra."
"I would say no to spaghetti straps and an open back, too."
"OP, YTA. Your bridesmaids don't have to love the dresses, but they should at least be able to comfortably wear them." ~ Maleficent_Tart2923
"YTA. You should never ask someone to expose parts of their body that they don't want to expose."
"You don't have to agree with their reasoning or follow the rules yourself, but you just do not get to tell someone they have to wear less clothing." ~ Fickle_Ostrich4923
"Agreed. But if this is the hill you want to die on then I say it's fine to tell them they can't be in the bridal party."
"You can choose someone else who is willing and able to wear that dress."
"They can put their foot down and so can you." ~ cbm984
OP came back to chat...
"Edit 3: Just in case anyone still cares and wants to be updated… I've called off the wedding!"
"This was essentially the last straw with the issues I have with my family, so I’m officially no-contact with them."
"I’m not going to go into the specifics, but it’s always been a battle to get along with them so when this has been pushed to no end I decided they care more about their stupid religion than they do me."
"It wasn’t just going to stop at the dresses… anyways."
"They are no longer on my list of priorities so I don't care about having a wedding at this point."
"My fiancé and i are just going to elope and have a small, celebratory gathering with our closest friends and his family."
"I haven’t felt this good in a while."
"I’m exhausted and sad about having to make the final push from my family, but I’m absolutely so happy to be done with their drama and bulls**t."
"Thanks to everyone who helped me see the clarity of the situation."
Well OP... this is a heck of a situation.
Reddit clearly wanted you to make some better choices.
And you found your way in the end.
Good luck.
Woman Asks If It's Wrong To Hold Grudge After Mom Told Her When She 8 Years Old That She Wished She'd Aborted Her
While some people view having and raising children as the greatest blessing, some parents hold their children's existence against them for their entire lives.
And when they feel that way about their children, they're unfortunately typically pretty honest about it, cringed the members of the "Am I Overreacting?" (AIO) subReddit.
Redditor heavelymango knew from the time she was young that her mother did not really like her and significantly favored her sister.
But when her mother told her at the age of eight that she wished she had aborted her, the Original Poster (OP) held on to that grudge for years after the fact.
She asked the sub:
The OP had a grudge against her mother.
"I (22 Female) have been holding onto a grudge due to something my mom told me when I was roughly eight or nine years old."
"Growing up, I was a rebellious kid and always felt as if my mom favored my older sister. My sister would always get whatever she wanted."
"I know she was born with Down syndrome and always needed more attention and care, but if my sister wanted my tablet, for example, she would have it for the whole day while mine was limited to 30 minutes so she could have it."
"As a kid, I lashed out more because of this. She could take all of my things, but I could never use hers."
During a heated moment, the OP's mother said something unforgivable.
"Eventually, this led to an argument with my mom. I don't recall the whole thing, but it was related to my sister and how I felt my mom didn't care about me or give me the same amount of attention."
"The fight got heated, and I probably told my mom that I hated my sister and her."
"I remember she said back, 'I never wanted you from the start. I knew I should've aborted you when I had the chance.'"
" I didn't know what aborted meant at the time, and I remember I looked it up, and it made me cry. I never forgot it, and it lingers in my mind whenever I am home."
The OP's mother pressured her to "let it go" and move on.
"Even growing up, I still brought it up, and she would get mad, saying I need to let it go and how I'm stubborn for not just forgetting what she said."
"There was even a time in high school when she took me to a therapist, and she complained about how I never dropped what she said."
"She says I need to move on from it because it has affected my relationship with her, and she wants to fix it."
"I know I'm older now and it was so long ago, but it still hurts, and I feel like it's made me not want to have her in my life in the future, and I have told this to her."
"How I don't want her in my life once I move out, get married, or have my own kids."
Fellow Redditors weighed in:
Some reassured the OP that this sounded like a core memory more than a grudge.
"The axe forgets. The tree remembers."
"It sounds less like you're holding a grudge and more that this is a formative, core memory for you."
"It won't stop being a core memory (unless maybe with the help of a lot of therapy). Has your mom ever apologized for saying that? Because you don't have to forget to forgive, but if she's not remorseful for saying that terrible thing to her young child (not just remorseful that you remember it), then she probably needs therapy (or is a narcissist/sociopath/similar)."
"You are certainly not obligated to 'get over it.'" - Hot-Can3615
"This is not a 'grudge'; it is pain that is still felt to such a degree. If she said it, then she was thinking it. She'll probably never apologize, but that doesn't mean your pain is or was invalid." - Fast_Register_9480
"NOR. This kind of thing needs a real apology. Like she needs to acknowledge the damage and genuinely care about it. Brushing it off won’t make it go away." - TentacleWolverine
"NOR. Did she really want to fix things? She basically just told you to get over it from the start instead of giving you a sincere apology."
"That isn't working on anything. She wants you to get over it so she can pretend that she never said it, so she doesn't have to feel bad about what she did. It doesn't sound like she cares much about how you feel."
"She just doesn't want to deal with it. For that reason, I would still have issues with what she said." - Chemical-Ad6809
"If your relationship with your mother is being affected by the actions of your mother, your mother is responsible for fixing it."
"You should know you probably aren't ever going to get closure, but you don't have to swallow it down. It helps to be the person you needed when you were younger out loud to yourself, but especially to others."
"For example: My name is Liz, and my mom told me to go ahead and do it already and save us all the heartache when I finally had the courage to tell her about how much I've been struggling with self-harm and suicidal ideation. I'm never going to forgive her for that, and we have never been close as a result of her actions."
"You aren't holding onto a grudge; you have a core memory of your mother distilling her feelings into a world-shattering sentence."
"You did not have a secure attachment before and can't have one now because of the deep trauma. You do not apologize for being stabbed."
"Find another therapist. I mean it. Someone who cares about your well-being wouldn't force you to apologize for being verbally abused as a child. I'm 29 now, and I lived through it. I still struggle with suicidal ideation daily, but once I stopped relying on my mom and unstable sources for support, my life got better immediately."
"You want things for comfort and familiarity. Don't let your mom or your therapist gaslight you into crossing a boundary."
"It might help to ask for a written five-part apology from your mom. 1. Acknowledge what you did 2. Say why it was wrong 3. Promise not to do it again 4. Ask how to make amends. 5. Share your feelings at this time if there's anything you'd like to say."
"My mom can be a good person and a bad mom and role model. Being in your own company is so much better than poor company." - PotLuckyPodcast
Others hoped the OP would go no contact with her mother sooner rather than later.
"NOR. It’s emotional abuse. And you do not owe her closeness after that, especially as she refuses to be accountable for that and try to make it up to you."
"She knows you have her number, and she can’t forgive you for knowing what a colloidal b***h she is."
"It’s unlikely that will change; it will at least be turned back on you with her the victim."
"Stop expecting her to apologize. If she doesn’t pay your bills, ghost her." - SnooCheesecakes2723
"My mom said something similar. My brother and I were adopted, and when I was a teen, in front of a church lady, she said, 'We didn't even really want you, but the people didn't want to split y'all up, so we just took you, too.'"
"Me and the church lady were shook. When I say my falbbers were ghasted. Like huh? She didn't remember saying that when I brought it up years after the fact."
"I also got grounded two times for two separate nine weeks (for C's on my report card) and a three and a half to four months (for smoking at 16 and getting caught because she liked to just pop up out of nowhere), and we just had a talk about that, and she didn't even remember."
"She said, 'No, I didn't. I never grounded you for that long,' and when I gave my rebuttal, she said, 'Well, if I did, it definitely wasn't for no nine weeks or months,' and this started because she was praising me for reading so much and liking books. I said, 'Well, when you were grounded like me, that's all I could do (no TV, no friends outside of school, no music, nothing but my room and books)."
"There's a reason I only call or answer her calls once or twice every few weeks. And I only call to get food, really..." - ManicalMoe
"‘Fine, I'm sorry’ is not an apology."
"Whilst I’m sure it was said in anger, most things said in anger have a grain of truth. There are also some things that no half-decent parent ever says to their children, no matter how angry they are, and this is one of them! It also sounds like she has made repeated similar comments of not wanting you as her child."
"I understand her eldest had a disability, but this is no excuse for neglecting and emotionally abusing her younger child. Lots of families deal with a child with additional needs whilst still managing to prioritise their other kids. Children with Down syndrome are capable of understanding ‘that’s your sister's, not yours; give it back’ !! It sounds like your mum has mental health issues?"
"Do you have a present father or other family you can turn to?"
"Protect your peace. Your mum has hurt you time and time again, honestly, for no real gain other than momentarily satisfying her anger. You owe this woman nothing." - Background_Term9810
"I went through something similar. When I was a little girl, my mother used to make comments that implied she didn't want me, though it was never that explicit. 'I only had you because your brother wanted a sister,' and 'My figure never recovered after you; after your brother, it did.'"
"Each comment stayed with me, but I never addressed it with her. I tried to move on and leave it in the past. She did a lot of horrible things throughout my life, but her behavior was always ignored because that's the precedent my dad set, where she can do essentially whatever she wants."
"A few months ago, she came to see me because I was desperate for help and sick. Instead of helping, she made my life so much worse. I won't go into details. At one point, I could no longer keep it inside, and I told her that she is a narcissist, to which she responded with, 'It would have been better if I had never had you.'"
"In some ways, it felt really good to hear her come out and say it. It felt good to hear the truth I've always known."
"I don't know what you should do, but I've chosen to not forgive."
"Every time I forgave, I just let her know that she can get away with whatever horrible things she had done. Her apologies were never real apologies. She always found ways to blame me or others for whatever she had done."
"And I'm truly just done with it. As sad as it is to not have a mom, it's sadder to pretend that you have one when in reality you don't... quite the opposite, if anything." - Neos_Mom
"So, OP, what will hurt more: keeping her and the grudge in your life or making a break and going low or no contact with her?"
"Frankly, we've no idea of what she might have been dealing with at the time, but regardless, what she said was said only to cause pain and suffering. 'Sorry' doesn't magic that intent away."
"Me, I think spending time alone or with friends or in therapy away from her might be what you need here. You might come to some sort of acceptance, but if this is something that's just going to keep coming between you, then stop trying to have that relationship." - Tal_Tos_72
After the OP received feedback, she shared a few clarifications from her original post.
"I wanted to clear some things up, take accountability where it's due, and provide some much-needed context from many people commenting the same questions."
"I want to be completely honest. We had many arguments, and I was a rebellious kid. I acted out and argued with my mom."
"I don't want to give off the impression that I was an entirely innocent kid who never did anything wrong and my mom just snapped out of nowhere. We both said hateful and hurtful things to each other during our fights."
"Growing up, the only way she would accept an apology was if I got on my knees and begged her for forgiveness. If I ever asked her to apologize to me, she would say, 'I have nothing to apologize for; you should be the one begging for my forgiveness.'"
The OP had a lot of physical memories, too.
"Things also would turn into physical arguments, not just verbal ones."
"There were times when she would get so angry she would get physical. Like yanking me by my hair, twisting my arms, or throwing things at me (like remotes, a bug spray can, or a radio)."
"When she yanked my hair, I would fight back just to get her to let me go, and she would scream that I was trying to kill her and she would get me arrested. When she twisted my arm, and I begged her to stop because it felt like it was going to break, she would say she hoped it did."
"When she threw objects at me, she would say she wished they would hit my face."
"I remember in middle school, during an argument, she said she wished she could break my face and that she hated it because I look like my dad. I won’t lie, whenever she said things like that, I would say nasty comments about how she chose to have him put us in her."
While the OP wasn't financially ready to move out yet, she hoped to as soon as possible.
"Why haven't I moved out yet? The main reason I haven't been able to move out is financial."
"I wasn't making enough to support myself without worrying about whether I’d end up having to crawl back home."
"Thankfully, I have recently found a better-paying job. My plan is to move out between mid-to-late October, or early November at the latest."
"The only reason I can't leave this exact second is because I have a few legal/administrative things to get cleared up so I’m completely untied from my mom, which will take a few weeks."
The OP also had proof that her mother liked her sister better.
"Has my mom ever admitted to favoring my sister? Yes."
"In arguments, she has explicitly told me that she doesn't see me as her legitimate daughter, and that she adored my sister more and forever will. She has also called me a 'monster,' told me there is a certain type of evil inside of me, and said she was afraid I would be just like my dad and try to harm them."
"She would even tell me that she was telling family and friends these things about me, but then later claim she 'just said it in the moment' and wouldn't be crazy enough to actually tell people that."
"Because I was so confused growing up and didn't know if she was lying or telling the truth, I started avoiding our family when they came over."
"Naturally, that just made things worse because she would get mad at me for avoiding them (even now as an adult), completely ignoring the fact that she was the one who lied about what she told them."
Unfortunately, the OP didn't have support from her father.
"What about my dad? My dad is not in my life."
"He was around sporadically, but never as a stable parent. My parents separated before I was born and divorced when I was two or three."
"Growing up, it was just constant back-and-forth toxicity, with him telling me how toxic my mother was, and her telling me the same about him."
"He would mostly only come over to see my sister, and often used me to care for her if he wanted to take her out to eat. Ultimately, my dad didn't care about anyone else other than my sister (and his drugs)."
"I hope this can clear some questions on the original post. I know I didn't provide many details as I originally should have. I honestly didn't want to post something too long, and I honestly did not expect it to be noticed."
"Thank you all for taking time to talk to me and share your thoughts."
The subReddit fully sided with the OP, pointing out that no matter how heated the moment was, it would never excuse the terrible things the OP's mother had said to her.
If the OP's mother really wanted a relationship with her, she'd drop the defensiveness and demands, offer a genuine apology, and work hard to be better for both of her children.
That takes a very rare kind of person to pull off, and it didn't sound like the OP's mother had that in her.
If you or someone you know is struggling, you can contact the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline at 988.
To find help outside the United States, the International Association for Suicide Prevention has resources available at https://findahelpline.com/i/iasp